I suspect so. I noticed it recently when I was reading a mainstream mystery novel (one of Dana Stabenow's Liam Campbell books), and there was suddenly a highly explicit sex scene in the middle of the story. This was definitely a change; while Stabenow has always had a fair amount of sex in her novels, mostly it's been offscreen or elided. This was the sort of thing I would classify as NC-17 in a piece of fanfiction. And, which I found more noteworthy, completely unsignaled in any of the metadata on the novel (cover, blurb, etc).
The Bujold book sounds interesting; I'll have to pick it up. Not sure why, but Monette's book doesn't appeal (I looked at it in the store). Fantasy can be hit or miss with me. I prefer SF.
the thing that makes you awesome is the thing that makes you suck Pithy, and so true... I definitely want Soon I'll Be Invincible.
Monette has a gift for character and worldbuilding; her biggest weakness is clearly pacing, but I just don't care, especially three books in. But there's no question that it's an investment: the worldbuilding is complex, she dumps you right in, and it takes a while to understand what's going on.
I think of myself as an SF fan, but these days I seem to be finding it easier to enjoy fantasy.
Is this a change in publishing generally? Are f/sf writers now more able to add in sex, or are their editors telling them to do it, or some combination of the two?
Not just able to add, but requested to do so. One comment I receive regularly in submitting novel-length fantasy (to agents and editors) is varyingly worded hints to up the sex and violence. I think that women writing sf/f in particular (unless they're writing literary sf/f) are somewhat expected to do this, from what I see on the shelves in read in book deal blurbs.
Now I know I don't have to read Bujold's latest series. It sounds like a variation on Aral and Cordelia, and I really wish she'd written more about them amid Miles' adventures.
I want more Miles too; I enjoy her space opera more than her fantasy. But she's clearly writing what she wants to write, and it is certainly far from bad. It's just not what I want it to be.
Miles as a supporting character. The mind boggles.
I actually think that'd be a fabulous way for her to get back to the Vor-verse. The last Vor book, Diplomatic Immunity was good, but I got a definite sense that while Bujold was not done with playing in the universe, she was finding it a little difficult to move forward with Miles as a character. She's brought him round full circle, to a place where his character is at peace and on good terms with life, i.e. perfect wife, perfect job, zygotes on the way to being kids, etc. Her best work, even from a non-Miles POV, has been when her characters start out miserable and disoriented to their fates : Gregor in The Vor Game, Mark in Mirror Dance, even Cordelia in BarrayarI think I'd love an Ivan novel. He is not only a great supporting character, but I also am curious about what his future holds because he's one character totally unsettled in life as yet. Plus: he brings the comedy. In some ways, I prefer the lighter novels in the series because she does have a deft hand at romantic comedy
( ... )
I've been a fan of your fanfic for years, so it was kind of strange seeing your name attached to a review of The Mirador on LT---blurring the lines between different parts of my life.
I really hope that Bujold dumps the sex scenes when she goes back to the Vorkosigan or Chalion series. To me they just felt awkward and too revealing, somehow. Of course, it didn't help that I loathed the way the characters in TSK talked, so the fact that there was dialogue during the sex scenes was probably part of what made them such uncomfortable reading for me.
I love The Mirador and its prequels so very, very much. I find it odd how many people have a problem with her pacing, since her characters are so interesting that most of the time I couldn't care less whether the plot is going anywhere.
but then I never had trouble tolerating him even when he was crazy and seeing animal-headed people all the timeI actually liked him better when he was crazy. I love what Sarah Monette did with him---creating this character who arouses your sympathy because
( ... )
Yes, the longer I'm in fandom, the more the threads seem to intertwine. I really like LT, and not just because we actually use Library of Congress labels to shelve our books
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I find, with good authors, that if they don't usually include explicit sex in their books, it's for a good reason---generally because such a scene would be unnecessary, obtrusive, or just wouldn't fit the tone of the book. I'm really not happy with the idea that publishers would request/demand explicit sex scenes from authors who don't usually provide them
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Comments 14
I suspect so. I noticed it recently when I was reading a mainstream mystery novel (one of Dana Stabenow's Liam Campbell books), and there was suddenly a highly explicit sex scene in the middle of the story. This was definitely a change; while Stabenow has always had a fair amount of sex in her novels, mostly it's been offscreen or elided. This was the sort of thing I would classify as NC-17 in a piece of fanfiction. And, which I found more noteworthy, completely unsignaled in any of the metadata on the novel (cover, blurb, etc).
The lines, they are blurring.
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the thing that makes you awesome is the thing that makes you suck Pithy, and so true... I definitely want Soon I'll Be Invincible.
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I think of myself as an SF fan, but these days I seem to be finding it easier to enjoy fantasy.
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First one-- I think I read an earlier book of hers-- tame.
I do remember when Elizabeth Moon and Mercedes Lackey each had a woman character who was raped and that was a big deal just a couple of years ago.
"powers...standing in for personality" Something I will be thinking about now.
spike
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Not just able to add, but requested to do so. One comment I receive regularly in submitting novel-length fantasy (to agents and editors) is varyingly worded hints to up the sex and violence. I think that women writing sf/f in particular (unless they're writing literary sf/f) are somewhat expected to do this, from what I see on the shelves in read in book deal blurbs.
Now I know I don't have to read Bujold's latest series. It sounds like a variation on Aral and Cordelia, and I really wish she'd written more about them amid Miles' adventures.
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Wow.
Miles as a supporting character. The mind boggles.
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I actually think that'd be a fabulous way for her to get back to the Vor-verse. The last Vor book, Diplomatic Immunity was good, but I got a definite sense that while Bujold was not done with playing in the universe, she was finding it a little difficult to move forward with Miles as a character. She's brought him round full circle, to a place where his character is at peace and on good terms with life, i.e. perfect wife, perfect job, zygotes on the way to being kids, etc. Her best work, even from a non-Miles POV, has been when her characters start out miserable and disoriented to their fates : Gregor in The Vor Game, Mark in Mirror Dance, even Cordelia in BarrayarI think I'd love an Ivan novel. He is not only a great supporting character, but I also am curious about what his future holds because he's one character totally unsettled in life as yet. Plus: he brings the comedy. In some ways, I prefer the lighter novels in the series because she does have a deft hand at romantic comedy ( ... )
Reply
I really hope that Bujold dumps the sex scenes when she goes back to the Vorkosigan or Chalion series. To me they just felt awkward and too revealing, somehow. Of course, it didn't help that I loathed the way the characters in TSK talked, so the fact that there was dialogue during the sex scenes was probably part of what made them such uncomfortable reading for me.
I love The Mirador and its prequels so very, very much. I find it odd how many people have a problem with her pacing, since her characters are so interesting that most of the time I couldn't care less whether the plot is going anywhere.
but then I never had trouble tolerating him even when he was crazy and seeing animal-headed people all the timeI actually liked him better when he was crazy. I love what Sarah Monette did with him---creating this character who arouses your sympathy because ( ... )
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