Science and democracy

Sep 11, 2006 10:04


   I am currently reading Chris Mooney's The Republican War on Science, which is, as one might be able to guess from the subtle connotations of the title, somewhat partisan in its analysis of governmental censorship and/or influence upon science in the last thirty years.

It has gotten me thinking about how science is and is not democratic. One of ( Read more... )

science, rant, organic, politics

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Comments 24

palecur September 11 2006, 19:29:13 UTC
As I understand the term, 'moral relativism' has the opposite meaning of the one you use here -- it's the position that, hey, who are we to judge what's "right" or "wrong" for people, because all moral positions are, you know, okay, from their own perspectives, right? And then you pass the bong.

Actually acknowledging that right and wrong, or good and evil, exist as non-relative concepts is what's rather de trop in academia these days.

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caramida September 11 2006, 20:00:57 UTC
palecur has a point....

Moral relativism holds "that moral or ethical propositions do not reflect absolute and universal moral truths, but instead make claims relative to social, cultural, historical or personal circumstances." These folk suggest that everything is more nuanced than it first appears, and that what's right for them, may not be right for you.

Moral universalism claims that "some system of ethics applies universally, that is to all humans regardless of culture, race, gender, religion, nationality, sexuality, or other distinguishing feature." Of course persons that propound a universal morality generally recommends that their own personal morality is just the universal morality everyone should follow ( ... )

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two more things palecur September 11 2006, 19:34:56 UTC
ideologues. Not idealogues. Yes, it's English being a tricky whore again.

About the theory of evolution in particular, I have always found it useful to point out that the 'Theory' part is not about whether or not evolution happens; that's been placed pretty firmly into the 'observed fact' column. When we say 'Theory of Evolution' we mean 'theory about how Evolution works,' much the same way as when we talk about the theory of gravity we don't mean gravity is a theory. We mean gravity is an observed fact, and we have a theory about how it works.

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I've thought for a long time.. ophymirage September 11 2006, 19:39:10 UTC
Science (SCIENCE!) needs to come up with another damn word. Because your average idiot American doesn't have enough scholarly background to understand that "theory" can have two (almost entirely opposite) meanings, one of which is quite specialized. (More to the point, they'll claim that having to know that falls into the 'librul elitist latte-drinking' category that makes them uncomfortable.)

if we get a different word, one that doesn't have the 'Wild-Ass-Unproven-Guess' annotation that 'theory' carries for the average American, we might avoid at least some of those stupid debates.

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Re: I've thought for a long time.. kid_lit_fan September 11 2006, 19:47:49 UTC
It took several years* of Steve saying "I don't think you mean theory, I think you mean hypothesis" to get it into my head.

*Not constantly, that would be exhausting for both of us. You know what I mean.

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Re: Steve purchasemonkey September 11 2006, 20:00:39 UTC

   Yeah, but you and Steve both rock ass. As such, you fundamentally get it. Go go well-informed skeptics!

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Autism and mercury purchasemonkey September 11 2006, 19:59:10 UTC

   Arrrrgh! Yes, that particular stupidity is singularly aggravating, especially because it is at its heart promulgated by the heartbroken parents of autistic children who need someone or something to explain the terrible injustice of the disease which has struck their beloved little ones. Just because it's sad doesn't mean it's not stupid.

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Re: Autism and mercury sgeorge1701 September 11 2006, 20:43:53 UTC
What people tend to forget is, that Mercury was added to SAVE lives while vaccinating (see snipet below). The threat of contamination or bacteria growth IN a vaccine that has travelled far in a truck in the 1930s was REAL - to add a little mercury to prevent the serious illnesses was (and is) a great idea ( ... )

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Deviating far to the left... sgeorge1701 September 11 2006, 21:29:41 UTC
I feel fairly comfortable in saying that deliberate acts of genocide are wrong.

I so agree with this, but you got me thinking. How do you have a "accidental" act of genocide. And if you could - would people forgive you for it?

"Sorry about those 10,000,000 people, you see, I put my coffee down on the corner of the desk and then I knocked it over, pulling my keyboard over and then I....

I'm really sorry..."

S

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Re: Deviating far to the left... sgeorge1701 September 11 2006, 21:30:42 UTC
PS

I MUST get a new 1950s style lab coat - chicks dig scientists with a cool lab coat.

S

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Re: accidental acts of genocide purchasemonkey September 11 2006, 21:37:41 UTC

   Strangely enough, I was thinking of an accidental genocide when I typed that, namely that which the conquistadors visited unknowingly upon the Aztecs and their client peoples: first-contact pandemic.

Essentially, I seem to recall hearing people say that no matter how bad the Aztecs were, the Europeans visited a ~90% death rate upon everyone with their evil diseases and their smallpox blankets, essentially putting forward the idea of germ warfare centuries before the germ theory of disease. Yes, I know the Mongols supposedly launched bodies over walls to spread disease. No, I don't believe the conquistadors or really anyone else (as I recall, the smallpox blankets story has proven apocryphal) tried to kill the Native Americans en masse deliberately, if nothing else because SOMEONE had to mine all that gold for them!

Not that your joke wasn't funny. I'm thinking now of the "It's a Mistake" video by Men At Work in the early 1980's....

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Re: accidental acts of genocide sgeorge1701 September 11 2006, 21:41:17 UTC
Heheheh,

It wasn't smallpox - the Aztecs had a word for it, they had ALREADY been exposed.

It was a DIFFERENT and LOCAL disease caused by rats living in close contacts during drought years.

When the drought ends, the rats scatter and breed spreading the new plague.

I wrote about it a few months ago - I'll find the post.

Steve

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Belated comment... shoutingboy September 21 2006, 23:29:15 UTC
I was meaning to reply to this. But on the whole, it's probably just as well that I waited a week, and let most of the other commenters move on...

Anyway, yeah, bad science sucks. But I think what you're usually seeing is non-ideological bad reporting. It's just that if a story is bad in general, you're more likely to notice where it slants to the other side.

F'r'ex, I expect that whenever you hear a story about global warming that overstates the case or the evidence, you have a tendency to mentally filter it--I know I do in similar circumstances. When a reporter says "human activity has caused such-and-such climate change", you mentally add the appropriate qualifiers, like "human activity is very likely to be a significant contributor to such-and-such". But perhaps you don't do it on the other side; e.g. when the "opposing view" spokesman says "there isn't proof of global warming", do you mentally translate it, saying "I'm sure he meant 'there isn't proof of significant human contribution to global warming"? Or do you just say, " ( ... )

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That article shoutingboy September 21 2006, 23:47:02 UTC
Here's the link to that article on SFGate.com.

The headline was "Report links global warming, storms", which sure seemed to say that the report had, well, linked global warming to storms.

The first paragraph gives a bit of a warning, though, if you read it carefully:

Scientists say they have found what could be the key to ending a yearlong debate about what is making hurricanes more violent and common -- evidence that human-caused global warming is heating the ocean and providing more fuel for the world's deadliest storms.

That is, the report found evidence that the oceans are warming--which I thought had already been well-established. (Nobody is seriously debating whether global warming has ocurred--the debate is about (a) how much human activity has contributed to it, (b) what the trend in the future will be, and (c) what the consequences will be.)

The next two paragraphs are a stunning non-sequitur:

For the past 13 months, researchers have debated whether humanity is to blame for a surge in hurricanes since the mid-1990s or ( ... )

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