a sorta fairy tale with you...

[pprfaith]

I wasted time in the children's section of a books shop today and noticed that fairy tales seem to be big again. Which, of course, gave me a story idea. Which, in turn, made me decide to brush up on my fairy tale knowledge

Comments

[paregmenon]

Writing that much by hand... ouchies. And I so want to read those original fairy tales - they're meant to be quite gruesome.

That actually is very interesting! When I was a kid, I used to want dragons in fairytales, but could hardly ever find any. Now, I have an answer! :D

And I once read a short ficlet about a damsel who is supposed to be rescued by a prince, but instead kills the dragon herself and steals the guy's horse. It was awesome.

[pprfaith]

I love modern fairy tales that break with the traditional roles, ie, girl saves herself. I try to do 'my own fairy tale' with my kids at least once a year and the results are amazing. Whoever said today's kids have no imagination was very, very wrong.

A friend of mine did a two week project with her fifth graders and one of the stories had little Red Riding Hood running the wolf over with a Ferari. Go girl!

As for the original fairy tales, I'd just about murder someone to get my hands on an old book. Alas, my university has an amazing collection of Arthurian legends and pretty much zip fairy tales. I mean, it's not hard to find what the original tales were like, but to actually read them, word for word... Those thing are pretty much the oldest horror stories around, yeah?

/geek fest

[vesselandpestle]

Oldest moral stories, definitely. Horror? *evil grin* Well, they're definitely the start of a LOT of common fetishes... not to mention all the rape-is-romance stuff that it played straight. In one of the older versions, Sleeping Beauty isn't woken by a kiss, she's woken by the birth of twins. Yes, you heard that right: her Prince Charming slept with her comatose body and impregnated her, waking her up mid-delivery.

I can never decide if that's creepier than the version where she sleeps through the delivery or not.

Also, since you've got me on the subject, here's link to an artist who does twisted Disney Princesses. They're made of awesome and win (especially the Tiana one) and I know that you'll love them.

http://jeftoon01.deviantart.com/gallery/#Twisted-Princess

[pprfaith]

I love you.

Where'd you get the Sleeping Beauty bit? Cuz I'm collecting websites at the mo.

[avamclean]

Of all the Grimms Fairy Tales I've read I think 'The Butcher' is the creepiest I've read. I love it because it's so creepy, but still. *shudders*

[vesselandpestle]

Hmmm... actually, the whole "knight vs. dragon" thing really depends on your definition of 'fairytales'. If you only count Grimms Brothers stories, then yes, you're right... but there's (I think) a larger canon of fairy/folktales to draw from, and a lot of those have some version of the "hero vs. draconic beast saves damsel" trope. I have a massive book of Italo Calvino's folktales, and amongst the maimings and gougings (oh god, the gougings!) there are a few stories that would qualify as hero vs. great beast gets girl type stuff.

I think that the whole knight vs. dragon thing (the specific naming, not the general idea) is from the story (which is not quite a myth, OR a fairytale) of St. George and the Dragon. At the very least, it is definitely the closest thing to the trope that we have.

[pprfaith]

Isn't St. George and the Dragon younger than the folklore versions? Like I said, the oldest goes back to Perseus vs. Kraken (Clash of the Titans, anyone?)

I count as fairy tales anything that has the classic symbols (numbers, archetypes, etc.) so that allows for a lot of folklore, too. My impression is that, at least in the German speaking stories, the big monster is usually symbolized by the wolf, not the dragon.

(Oh, and speaking of creepy, read Snow, Glass, Apples by Neil Gaiman. That's the creepiest version of Snowwhite you will find. Ever.

[vesselandpestle]

Oh yes, George and the Dragon is VERY young by folk/fairytale standards. I wasn't saying that it was the origin, but I do think that it became the trope-namer. It's a lot easier to generalize "dragon" than it is to say, "large scary beast of indeterminate nature and abilities". Perseus vs. sea-beast (the Kraken is from NORSE MYTHOLOGY DAMNIT), Theseus vs. minotaur, Bellerophon vs. chimera, Greek mythology is all about pitting hot young men/ demi-gods against vicious monsters... damsel does not necessarily come with set and may need to be purchased seperately.

The big monster really depends on the culture from which the fairytale springs. My big book of Italian folktales has critters ranging from sea-beasts to snake-beasts and all over the animal kingdom, but that range can easily be explained by the fact that Italy was big on the trade and was probably getting stories and archetypes from all over the world and mixing them with their own.

0_0 OH MY GOD. Thanks ever so much for that. It was incredibly disturbing. And creepy.

[pprfaith]

Thank you, finally someone who's with me on the Kraken issue. I started screaming bloody murder in the cinema and no-one got it. But hey, Io's not a cow, the Medusa is the size of a freight train and Zeus PARDONES the not-cow at the end. The frick? Also, Io bangs Zeus. Who then hands her off to his bastard son? What's the ancient Greek word for 'recylcling'?

The monsters are obviously very localised. Try finding a German story that has a sea monster. Not gonna happen. The northern areas, that aren't landlocked, have surprisingly few and bad stories.

Does George and the Dragon have a swooning maiden? I don't actually know the details.

Have I mentioned that I madly envy you for all that fairy tale knowledge? I love them, but it's so hard to get your hands on good books around here. Most are old/out of print and we don't really have such a thing as second hand bookshops. It's either new or a shot in the dark. So, major envy! I have a few collections, but those are all the cleaned up, modern versions. Meh. Must scour web.