I have another friend who I think liked it and is concerned about saying so in public (even public under flock) because so many of her friends are upset about it
( ... )
I know I say this again and again, but I came into fandom through Stargate and survived the Daniel/Jack/Sam shipper wars by, well, being on neither side. I also learned to mostly avoid fandom except for the "sane" corner because of it.
I've only seen old school Who sporadically, I started watching with Nine, tho I'd seen some old eps before that but yeah, I never got the impression that any of the companions were supposed to be fixated before Rose. But again, having not seen much of it, that could be qualified as an "unqualified opinion" LOL.
I also have real problems with fan entitlement in many areas (see: Stargate). Actually, I just have issues with entitlement in general but that's a completely different discussion.
Yeah, I pretty much don't engage in fandom proper other than as a lurker. When I write about meta in my own journal, it's mostly for a non-fannish audience. We're crazy, just in a different way. :)
I was a big Four fan when I was wee, and Sarah Jane was my first companion, so the nonromantic relationship is standard/default for me. The only companion I think of the Doctor as potentially getting it on with is Romana. Rose, in particular, is so immature that I have real problems with the Doctor being interested in her. It's not child molestation, but it does have a skeevy vibe to me because of the age/power/maturity differences.
And, yes, generally to issues of fannish entitlement. There are reasons why I was comparing it to comic books, which have pretty much destroyed their sales appeal to kids by getting into bad engagement with fans who insist on continuity and resolving things their way. At least now they have alternate universes for kid books, many of which I'm told are better written than the mainstream universe books.
I'm interested in the new doctor and companion because there was such a continuum through Rose -> Donna. The college kid --> the professional --> Mistress of Life of Hard Knocks. I think each appealed to a different part of fandom.
I liked Ianto as a character. I liked Jack/Ianto, but it was Ianto himself I was mostly drawn to. (Also, this is Torchwood and I'm not convinced that they won't find a way to bring Ianto back if that's what they want to do.)
I really did like the juxtaposition of how the government officials absolutely would not allow their own children to be put in danger. But Jack, stuck between a rock and a hard place and time ticking down, made the only decision he could make. Lost everything in the process, but he did it.
I think the difference between Jack and Frobisher is who they were doing it for. Frobisher was really doing it for himself. One could argue that he did it for his family as well, but mostly himself and knew he wouldn't have to live with it afterwards. Made certain of it, even.
Jack did it for 600 million children and he couldn't really run away from it. Even leaving at the end didn't do more than distance himself from Earth. It's always going to be with him.
I wasn't surprised Jack left either. Afterall, Jack IS human. No more smart no more sneaky, no more able to figure things out than anyone else. Yet the TW team (Gwen in particular) ALWAYS turned to him and expected him to fix everything. And tended to get pissy if he fixed it in a way they didn't like (as Small Worlds showed).
He's not the Doctor, he doesn't have special powers, all he has is 51st century upbringing and some extra training. And he's pretty shattered by what happened. He needs to regroup.
Honestly, I don't think Torchwood would work as a show without Jack, but I'd be willing to give it a try if they chose to do it that way
I liked it...in fact it was the first Torchwood I did like. (I stopped watching early in on Season 2) and while I couldn't and wouldn't have done what Jack did...I got that doing that is why he's Jack. I was watching it with my husband and said "She'll never ever forgive him...and he'll never forgive himself." but obviously he had to do it because he wasn't the doctor and can't pull magic out of his ass
( ... )
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I've only seen old school Who sporadically, I started watching with Nine, tho I'd seen some old eps before that but yeah, I never got the impression that any of the companions were supposed to be fixated before Rose. But again, having not seen much of it, that could be qualified as an "unqualified opinion" LOL.
I also have real problems with fan entitlement in many areas (see: Stargate). Actually, I just have issues with entitlement in general but that's a completely different discussion.
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I was a big Four fan when I was wee, and Sarah Jane was my first companion, so the nonromantic relationship is standard/default for me. The only companion I think of the Doctor as potentially getting it on with is Romana. Rose, in particular, is so immature that I have real problems with the Doctor being interested in her. It's not child molestation, but it does have a skeevy vibe to me because of the age/power/maturity differences.
And, yes, generally to issues of fannish entitlement. There are reasons why I was comparing it to comic books, which have pretty much destroyed their sales appeal to kids by getting into bad engagement with fans who insist on continuity and resolving things their way. At least now they have alternate universes for kid books, many of which I'm told are better written than the mainstream universe books.
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I really did like the juxtaposition of how the government officials absolutely would not allow their own children to be put in danger. But Jack, stuck between a rock and a hard place and time ticking down, made the only decision he could make. Lost everything in the process, but he did it.
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Which also parallels nicely with Frobisher. Who also lost everything, including himself, doing what he thought he had to do.
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Jack did it for 600 million children and he couldn't really run away from it. Even leaving at the end didn't do more than distance himself from Earth. It's always going to be with him.
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He's not the Doctor, he doesn't have special powers, all he has is 51st century upbringing and some extra training. And he's pretty shattered by what happened. He needs to regroup.
Honestly, I don't think Torchwood would work as a show without Jack, but I'd be willing to give it a try if they chose to do it that way
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