ph33r me, 4 i ramble on ur frENDS lizt

[paulhope]

I used to think (a) all cities were like New York City, and (b) I hated cities. Now I've lived in other cities enough to know that I was wrong on both counts.

Comments

[synapsomatic]

"Such sensitive men, we are."

*smiles*

Indeed. And it is too bad our culture has made such a big deal out of stupid things, "be a man!" I mean, come on, wtf does that even mean?? Did we somehow flip back to the world of Germanic tribes or something? Maybe other cultures suffer it, too though, but I can't really speak for them. I guess the whole male/female//man/woman dynamic has been a deeply troubling one for humans all along the way. And the solution seems so obvious. Um, forget about it? Stop trying so goddamn hard to fit yourself into some artificial standard because someone tells you should, when you'll find that if you just simply be, you'll be just fine?? Did anyone think of that?

People are amazingly silly, and they perplex me. I can hardly even count myself as one of them.

Ooo, particle physics? Now that is sexy! (And I mean "sexy" in the way that you might use it if you just read some amazingly awesome theory, of course.)

[paulhope]

"Such sensitive men, we are."

To be fair to myself, I was saying that with a thick layer of irony.

On the other hand, I'm not gonna lie: despite being able to laugh at it, I won't deny that I sometimes find myself holding myself up to certain ideals that I would probably inadequately communicate by talking about "manhood" and "manliness." I don't think this is what I was doing in my post (where I was pointing out our departure from masculine stereotypes without meaning to make any value judgments, really), but I think the "be a man!" thing you pointed out may work differently.

Of course I'm sympathetic to your "just be" attitude--how could any not be?--but I think it's not as easy to dismiss these attitudes as all that.

First I want to throw in a totally controversial disclaimer: I think the "manhood" attribute is not really as gendered as it seems to be. I mean, it may be that it is transmitted and applied to males, but I'm not sure that it's content has anything to do with men-as-opposed-to-women. I think it's connotations

[theshowmustgo0n]

I think the "manhood" attribute is not really as gendered as it seems to be.

Um, I think it is. Your point that "manliness" or "be a man" connotes a comparison between men-and-lesser-men more often than might be recongnized is true, but I don't know if they are "much more" about that than men-as-opposed-to-women. Being called a "pussy" or, less crassly, "girly" is as much, if not more, the converse of "manly" as is "immature" or "little boy-like". Seconly, if "manly" were not as gendered as it seems to be, then women would not take offense at being called manly--calling a woman manly is not as flatteringg as calling a man manly. One might say it is too bad that women can't be flattered by being called manly, but in it's usage, it is simply not (yet) meant to flatter women.

Then your later point:
So I think that when, for example, a male friend of mine is showing reluctance to put himself into an uncomfortable position which has the promise to improve his own lot and the life of those around him, it might be appropriate to tell

[paulhope]

Um, I think it is. Your point that "manliness" or "be a man" connotes a comparison between men-and-lesser-men more often than might be recongnized is true, but I don't know if they are "much more" about that than men-as-opposed-to-women. Being called a "pussy" or, less crassly, "girly" is as much, if not more, the converse of "manly" as is "immature" or "little boy-like".

I generally agree, but I think there's a lot of individual difference in how people use these words. I had a lot of time to contemplate this on the ski trip I was just on with seven male friends with different attitudes towards this kind of thing. Certainly, several of them commonly used "pussy" in opposition to "manly."

But I was trying to be as generous in my interpretation of the word as possible, and trying to express something closer to my own usage. When I think to myself, "be a man," I certainly am not implying that if I am not a man at that point, then I will be a woman. That doesn't make any sense

[unthevert]

*happy*

you should indeed read anna karenina. i've been pretty skeptical about tolstoy before, since the only thing i've read was childhood, boyhood, and youth (the first thing he wrote - i had to read it in fifth grade, and it was a bunch of autobiographical bullshit with a christian agenda to boot). but i read anna karenina last summer, and it turns out he's an excellent psychologist. his ability to describe indescribable things in words is pretty amazing. so i'm actually planning on starting war and peace next week.

[paulhope]

it turns out he's an excellent psychologist. his ability to describe indescribable things in words is pretty amazing.

That's an intriguing endorsement. Consider me sold. I'll add it to that back-of-the-head list of things to read one day.

[theshowmustgo0n]

NY's subway system is totally comprehensible! Blasphemy.

Also, I think synapsomatic is right that culture has made too big a deal out of stupid things like manliness. Consequently, you should be able to wear a helmet when you ski, mister.

Also, cute neuro reference. But then I remembered what I had defensively repressed...something about you...neuro 1...makes me want to grab you by the pituitary!

[paulhope]

Give me color-coded Boston any day. Now that's an easy-to-understand subway system.

makes me want to grab you by the pituitary!

Gentle!