Science Fiction

[parma_violets]

Recently, and largely in response to my reviews of the new series of Doctor Who, I've been challenged by some friends to define what it is I don't like about science fiction. I must say, it wasn't always this way; I was quite a fan when I was younger, but increasingly it seems to be the genre that turns me off more than any other

Comments

[anonymous]

Ah, but there's a sting in the tale with the sci-fi you do like, as far as I can tell. I've seen Alien, Aliens, 2001 and the John Hurt/Richard Burton Nineteen Eighty-four, and I've read Nineteen Eighty-four and Death and the Compass. Virtually none of them I would classify as sci-fi.

Alien is a horror. Aliens is an action film. Nineteen Eighty-four is a political thriller. And I have no idea what genre Death and the Compass is, but I don't think it's sci-fi; it certainly didn't strike me as such. 2001 is much closer to sci-fi, admittedly, but then it's directed by Stanley Kubrick. Enough said.

As someone with close on no interest in sci-fi either, I began thinking of Solaris, which as you know is my favourite film. Suddenly it hit me; these films, and to a large extent Doctor Who use sci-fi as a peg. They want to get somewhere - make you think, scare you, thrill you - and the easiest way to do that is to use sci-fi trappings. Take Doctor Who, for example; the creation of the TARDIS was a stroke of absolute genius as it meant you

[baron_scarpia]

Gah, that was me. Forgot I wasn't logged in.

[parma_violets]

Death and the Compass, the film by Alex Cox, is closer to sci-fi than anything else; it's set in a nameless Latin American dystopia, Red Scharlach appears to be partly robotic and there are Clockwork Orange-style gangs running around everywhere. None of these things distracts from the overall point of the story, which is a good lesson in how sci-fi trappings can be applied without swamping the narrative.

(Of course, it doesn't hurt that the sci-fi is more in the vein of 1970s British telefantasy, rather than Hollywood sci-fi)

I would argue that the Alien franchise is sci-fi if it is anything; the common denominator in Scott's horror movie, Cameron's war movie, Fincher's religious tragedy and Jenuet's drivel is the science fiction elements. And 1984 and 2001 were almost certainly regarded as sci-fi when they came out because their titular years were so distant; the fact that they endure now is not, I would argue, proof that they weren't really sci-fi, it's proof that an intelligent writer or director can always transcend genre

[baron_scarpia]

I would argue that the Alien franchise is sci-fi if it is anything; the common denominator in Scott's horror movie, Cameron's war movie, Fincher's religious tragedy and Jenuet's drivel is the science fiction elements.

So sci-fi's being treated as a peg for all the separate films to hang on?

I'm not saying, by the way, that 2001 and Nineteen Eighty-four endure because they aren't sci-fi; Asimov endures, for example. I'm merely saying that Nineteen Eighty-four has never struck me as a sci-fi. Even when it was released in 1948, televisions had been created. Totalitarian regimes were nothing new. Yes, Orwell did extend, bend, develop and create some elements, but calling it sci-fi, in my opinion, goes rather too far.

[simian_jack]

I'll get back to this later, but I want to recommend a tv show I think you and Ashley might both be able to enjoy - it's the only sf tv production I feel at all confident urging on you: the reworked Battlestar Galactica. I know, stop retching, it's not the old show in the least.

Don't let the thought of rampant robots and space dogfights put you off, the sf is limited to the setting. The meat of the writing is in the twisting of politics, religious beliefs and dogma, and personal relationships in the middle of a war. The writers have been taking ethical beliefs of any political stripe and putting them in very uncomfortable poses. People who hate sci-fi are calling it the best thing on tv. I agree with 'em.

[parma_violets]

If I catch any of it, I'll give it a look!

[simian_jack]

I think I might be getting a clearer understanding of what you don't like, but not necessarily where the line falls. That's because science fiction has been my first love since the age of three, and for me amost all of it has something to offer - it goes dry for you faster than me

[baron_scarpia]

For me - I've seen episodes of Firefly - the difference is purely that in general I prefer watching vampires to spaceships. (I also prefer watching vampires to wizards and swordsmen; the fantasy genre is not one I'm comfortable with either)

From what I saw of Firefly - three episodes in quick succession - it's not any worse than your average Buffy episode if you take away my personal preference. But, however much I pretend otherwise in my reviews, the personal continually leaks into the critical, which is why you're unlikely to see the Star Trek Project appearing any time soon on my LJ.

[demona_hw]

I actually think Firefly is better than Buffy. At it's best (by which I mostly mean season 3) Buffy was some of the best television I've seen, but the quality of a lot of the other seasons I think had to be taken into account.

Firefly was great straight off the bat. Partly no doubt because the writers had a lot more experience by that point (although that wasn't so evident in late Buffy and Angel), partly because they had a much better cast. A lot of the actors in Buffy weren't very good, and while they certainly grew into the roles I think there was always some deficiency.

Of course Firefly only got half a season (although it included single episodes to rivel the quality of much more long-standing shows), and as far as I can tell the stumbling block was the spaceships. Buffy and Angel fans by and large did not transfer to Firefly because they thought it wasn't their thing. One year after it was cancelled a lot of them get round to watching it on the DVD release and suddenly start going "Hey! This is great!" but far too late

[demona_hw]

In fact the more I think about it I find Firefly much more dependent on its western heritage for its plotting than its sci-fi one. The sci-fi elements of Firefly are much more in the 'wouldn't it be cool' vein, where as the stories are simple heists, fighting bad guys, defending good ones. Pretty much like Buffy, but with added crime.

Re: By the BEARD of the SKY-DEMON

[parma_violets]

I think you're misinterpreting my post; I love both The Pirate Planet and The Ribos Operation, and would never change a thing about either of them. (Well, OK. The Shrivenzale)

I'm not trying to compare them with each other; I'm comparing them with other science-fiction and explaining why they work so much better than most of the genre.

The science in The Pirate Planet doesn't bother me. I have no interest in physics at all, so it's a measure of Adams's achievement that I can happily sit through the Doctor or Ford Prefect or someone discussing matters of physics in his work. If that sort of thing does interest you, fair enough, it's a little added bonus. But even though it doesn't interest me, Adams is capable of talking about it in a way that makes me understand his passion. That's why he's a brilliant writer and Clarke and Asimov - IMNSHO - are not.

Re: By the BEARD of the SKY-DEMON

[gileswl]

Graham, until you stop saying that Clarke and Asimov write about physics and start saying that Clarke writes about religion, metaphysics, human obsession and perception and how science and other aspects of modernity impact these things, and that Asimov is interested in history, the effect of environments on the human psyche and whether free will is meaningful in light of what we know about those two subjects, it's going to be very hard for anyone to attach much weight to your arguments.

Re: By the BEARD of the SKY-DEMON

[parma_violets]

Giles, if you don't mind, I'm going to wind this discussion up now. Evidently this has touched some kind of raw nerve with you that I never intended it to, and I don't want to piss you off any more because I love you, and I suspect you could do without all this hassle, and I certainly could at the moment.