Am I alone in just not caring how many gay people there are in the UK?
Either people are straight, or they're gay, or they're bi, or they're none of the above, or they're still in the process of making up their minds. Whatever. Its their business, not mine. In taking the Daily Fail et al. seriously in their whining about this and coming up with ways to try to refute this survey you're falling in to the same trap that they are; that the proportions are relevant to arguments/discussions on rights or equality. They are not.
It could be 0.1%, 1%, 10% or more and it would make no difference whatsoever to the basic principle that it is no one elses business. And THAT is the point that we should be stressing.
Um, maybe it's just because one of my biggest pet peeves is hetornormativity in pop culture, including straight-until-proven-gay assumptions and underrepresentation in media, but I'd kind of like the real percentage of gay people to be out there. There are reasons that this information is a good thing to get right that have nothing to do with assuming that only populations that account for ten percent or more of the total deserve equal rights or some nonsense, and nobody is ever required to answer any poll truthfully or to provide any answer at all. Statistics are compiled about all sorts of things, and the fact that they are is not saying that everyone needs to share everything about themselves with the world.
While it is better to get such information right than wrong, it is better again to treat the process with silent contempt.
I really don't care whether someone is portrayed as straight or gay or whatever else. I think it is mistaken to assume that anything other than modal will ever be the default assumption in ANYTHING, whether it is sexuality, employment, whether you drive, whether you drink, whether you eat meat, or anything else. And largely I don't think it matters. What does matter isn't whether or not people make such assumptions, what matters is the value judgements they make if that assumption is incorrect.
The proportion of any population doing, thinking, being or believing (x), (y) or (z) is only relevant if we accept that there is some kind of cut of point at which whatever it is becomes valid. Thats a premise we should fight against as strongly as possible.
I really don't care whether someone is portrayed as straight or gay or whatever else.
That's really fantastic for you. Also irrelevant.
I think it is mistaken to assume that anything other than modal will ever be the default assumption in ANYTHING...And largely I don't think it matters.
You don't see the social problems caused by assigning one trait to be the default, whether it's race, religion, sexuality, gender, etc? You don't see the problem with the assumption that every character in a book is white unless specified otherwise, or that any movie with a female lead is a movie for girls and any movie with a black cast is a movie for black people? You don't see what a huge source of othering this is? You don't see how this makes minorities feel like outsiders? You don't see the problem with the assumption that anyone can identify with a straight white cisgendered man but it doesn't work the other way around? Are you serious?
What does matter isn't whether or not people make such
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1) Where did they get their original figures from? Because if they did a survey or something, I certainly wasn't part of it /:
2) I do not like the assumption the journalists seem to be making that just because there may be fewer queer people than they thought, equality is therefore somehow now less important.
While I am sure that is a an underestimate of the LGBT population in the UK...
2.2 million is our baseline figure, we know that there are at least this many LGBT people in the UK, but Gaydar, despite its popularity, does not represent 100% of the gay population.
Is gaydar unlike other gay dating sites, where one person often has multiple accounts? If not, I seriously doubt that there are 2.2 million unique users of that site.
Even if every member had made a second account, 1.1 million is still half again what the survey says. If you assume only 1/2 or 1/3 of Britons have registered there, that ends up being even more than shown in the survey.
Oh sure, and like I said, the original figure they came out with sounds far too low. I was just annoyed with the assumption in the OP that 2.2 million is a "baseline". That's a pretty bold statement, and I doubt it is supported in reality. If the OP article does not want to lose credibility, referencing a site where people can create multiple profiles is not the route to go.
You can make a few statistical assumptions though--like there are more gay people not registered on that site than there are people with multiple accounts.
I don't think the source is saying it's the survey that went wrong, rather that news media were taking numbers from this kind of a survey and treating them as actual fact.
Asking people personal questions about whether or not they're a member of a marginalized group over the phone is bad methodology, and phone surveys are bad methodology in the first place. I don't take any statistic seriously that's compiled from a phone survey.
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Either people are straight, or they're gay, or they're bi, or they're none of the above, or they're still in the process of making up their minds. Whatever. Its their business, not mine. In taking the Daily Fail et al. seriously in their whining about this and coming up with ways to try to refute this survey you're falling in to the same trap that they are; that the proportions are relevant to arguments/discussions on rights or equality. They are not.
It could be 0.1%, 1%, 10% or more and it would make no difference whatsoever to the basic principle that it is no one elses business. And THAT is the point that we should be stressing.
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I really don't care whether someone is portrayed as straight or gay or whatever else. I think it is mistaken to assume that anything other than modal will ever be the default assumption in ANYTHING, whether it is sexuality, employment, whether you drive, whether you drink, whether you eat meat, or anything else. And largely I don't think it matters. What does matter isn't whether or not people make such assumptions, what matters is the value judgements they make if that assumption is incorrect.
The proportion of any population doing, thinking, being or believing (x), (y) or (z) is only relevant if we accept that there is some kind of cut of point at which whatever it is becomes valid. Thats a premise we should fight against as strongly as possible.
Reply
I really don't care whether someone is portrayed as straight or gay or whatever else.
That's really fantastic for you. Also irrelevant.
I think it is mistaken to assume that anything other than modal will ever be the default assumption in ANYTHING...And largely I don't think it matters.
You don't see the social problems caused by assigning one trait to be the default, whether it's race, religion, sexuality, gender, etc? You don't see the problem with the assumption that every character in a book is white unless specified otherwise, or that any movie with a female lead is a movie for girls and any movie with a black cast is a movie for black people? You don't see what a huge source of othering this is? You don't see how this makes minorities feel like outsiders? You don't see the problem with the assumption that anyone can identify with a straight white cisgendered man but it doesn't work the other way around? Are you serious?
What does matter isn't whether or not people make such ( ... )
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2) I do not like the assumption the journalists seem to be making that just because there may be fewer queer people than they thought, equality is therefore somehow now less important.
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2.2 million is our baseline figure, we know that there are at least this many LGBT people in the UK, but Gaydar, despite its popularity, does not represent 100% of the gay population.
Is gaydar unlike other gay dating sites, where one person often has multiple accounts? If not, I seriously doubt that there are 2.2 million unique users of that site.
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