Hah! I still lean to the right, even though I am more of a centrist. But I will not be an Obama supporter. I really have an issue with his following a racist spiritual leader for 20+ years and supposedly not knowing it. There may be racists that back McCain and Palin but those racists weren't shaping the mind of the next possible leader of this country. From things he says and programs he wants, I see our taxes going way up and most Americans can't afford that. But I don't really like McCain either. I just don't know.
Mum, the only thing I'm going to say is I really don't understand your reasoning. Seriously. It sounds like you think Obama is going to go out and hurt America and Americans
( ... )
I love you too and agree about not debating. I will just say this - my opinion of him, his church and pastor is from first hand experience and quite frankly that church scares the crap out of me. Like I said I don't really like McCain either and some of his antics. I think he has made some really poor choices and is a complete bonehead.
I think Obama said it best the other day, Democrats are really good at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. However, his numbers are posed for a landslide victory ... 344 to 150-ish in the electoral college. I've become so neurotic over the poll numbers that I check them twice a day and flail at a tenth of a percentage point change. There is some worry over the Bradley effect that was mentioned. But I think even if you were to count that in, he'd still walk away with over 270. Something that isn't making very many headlines yet is that early voting has already begun in several states. Reports are that most early voters are Democrats, which could just be the Obama enthusiasm. (I'm not going to wait!! I'm going to vote for him NOW!!!*squee*)
I am quietly optimistic that he can do it and planning to move to Australia if McCain wins.
I think we'll see closer results than the wished-for landslide scenario. The undecideds who may vote for McCain b/c he's the more familiar candidate, or b/c they won't vote for an African-American, or are concerned about his past associates will, I think, be a factor. The way I see it, a person may have been connected to or had people in their lives that may be unsavory, but I try to look at how a person conducts him/herself. I think you can have a religious adviser that you do not agree with, and that, regardless of what s/he may say, you can take that and process it with a different outcome than perhaps what that person may want. Basically, I believe in the ability to use process info and disagree with people on certain things, while perhaps agreeing with them on others.
I do think Obama's momentum will get him elected, but it'll be a close run thing. And I won't move to Australia if McCain wins b/c I believe we'll need sane ppl here to continue combating prejudice.
I agree. I don't think it's going to be the landslide they would like. From what I've seen, the polls are fairly close. Obama may lose it based on being African-American and Muslim
( ... )
Snoods, you're not the only ostrich on my flist (and now not even one) so don't worry, twasn't aimed specifically at you and you're free to switch between camps. Caring and not-caring camps, that is... no switching between political camps :p
The separation of church and state is an odd bunny, isn't it? In the UK it's a legal requirement to have some sort of assembly-with-a-moral (and religious is pretty much included in this term although not officially) every day in schools, yet Tony Blair was careful to keep very quiet about his Catholicism til after he stepped down as PM... whereas in the US where prayer etc is actually banned from public schools, it seems like you stand no chance of getting elected unless you spend a long time making apparently heartfelt speeches about just how much God means to you.
I'm not sure I have a point here, but I do agree with yours (hooray!). Plus - are you sure Obama is a muslim? I didn't think he was.
No, he's not. His father was, which is where the whole muslim connection comes in and why people are trying to portry him as such. Frankly, it shouldn't matter whether he is or not. Personally, I don't care if he's praying to Allah or God, or the tree in his backyard as long as he's working for a better country.
It's also not that I didn't care, it's just that I thought there was nothing I can do about it anyway, so why bother. Plus, I'm sandwiched in between lots of Dem friends, Swiss people who, like the British, left of the Americans even at their furthest right (excepting the crazies who just shouldn't count anyway) and Republican relatives, so I tend to feel a bit buffeted and prefer to just stay out of the discussions. I also feel like it's nearly impossible to defend one point or the other when both sides are basically constantly lying through their teeth. It's difficult to know who's lies are the least damaging.
I have really held back on the posting about the elections this year. Mainly because my flist has had many a purge and most of the people on it are like-minded, so no one to argue with.
That being said, I do read five newspapers a day (NYTimes, WaPo, Toronto Globe and Mail, The Guardian, and the Ottawa Citizen) plus tons on politico blogs and consider myself pretty damn well informed.
One of the most frustrating things I have learned this year is that so much of what people believe is based on emotion, not reason. And you can't change that for them. You can reason at them until you are blue in the face, but if they are emotionally invested somehow in what they think, you maybe as well try and convert your cat to socialism as that will be more successful. I find this to be almost universally true about religion and somewhat so about politics.
Comments 22
*Snor snogs*
Reply
Reply
I think I am writing you in.
Reply
Um, on a side note...Grace just farted and I seriously think I'm choking to death...
Oh. My. Gawd.
Reply
I am quietly optimistic that he can do it and planning to move to Australia if McCain wins.
Reply
I do think Obama's momentum will get him elected, but it'll be a close run thing. And I won't move to Australia if McCain wins b/c I believe we'll need sane ppl here to continue combating prejudice.
Reply
Reply
The separation of church and state is an odd bunny, isn't it? In the UK it's a legal requirement to have some sort of assembly-with-a-moral (and religious is pretty much included in this term although not officially) every day in schools, yet Tony Blair was careful to keep very quiet about his Catholicism til after he stepped down as PM... whereas in the US where prayer etc is actually banned from public schools, it seems like you stand no chance of getting elected unless you spend a long time making apparently heartfelt speeches about just how much God means to you.
I'm not sure I have a point here, but I do agree with yours (hooray!). Plus - are you sure Obama is a muslim? I didn't think he was.
Reply
It's also not that I didn't care, it's just that I thought there was nothing I can do about it anyway, so why bother. Plus, I'm sandwiched in between lots of Dem friends, Swiss people who, like the British, left of the Americans even at their furthest right (excepting the crazies who just shouldn't count anyway) and Republican relatives, so I tend to feel a bit buffeted and prefer to just stay out of the discussions. I also feel like it's nearly impossible to defend one point or the other when both sides are basically constantly lying through their teeth. It's difficult to know who's lies are the least damaging.
Reply
Reply
I have really held back on the posting about the elections this year. Mainly because my flist has had many a purge and most of the people on it are like-minded, so no one to argue with.
That being said, I do read five newspapers a day (NYTimes, WaPo, Toronto Globe and Mail, The Guardian, and the Ottawa Citizen) plus tons on politico blogs and consider myself pretty damn well informed.
One of the most frustrating things I have learned this year is that so much of what people believe is based on emotion, not reason. And you can't change that for them. You can reason at them until you are blue in the face, but if they are emotionally invested somehow in what they think, you maybe as well try and convert your cat to socialism as that will be more successful. I find this to be almost universally true about religion and somewhat so about politics.
So yeah. I'm just here for the tea.
*loves*
Reply
Leave a comment