Comments | moonspinner: In which I declare myself a fandom heretic

moonspinner

In which I declare myself a fandom heretic

Dec 06, 2010 15:44

After the euphoria of Atla's Book 3 (Fire) wore off, I realized that I had some issues with it. And some is an understatement. It took me a while (another understatement) to put them together with any degree of coherency. I don't think I succeeded. But here they are, at last, to all intents and cathartic purposes.

( Cut for spoilers and heresies )

meta, avatar the last airbender

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inuyatta December 7 2010, 06:17:09 UTC

Despite the minor wank that seems to have cropped up either here or elsewhere, I agree with this post fully. And no, I have not ever shipped Zutara either ( ... )

moonspinner December 21 2010, 18:09:42 UTC

Firstly, I LOVE YOUR SONG icon so much! Wow! I just remembered how much she rocked her one episode ( ... )

moonspinner December 21 2010, 20:09:25 UTC

Gosh, I hate LJ! Do you know I hit post and went off to do something, only to find out the second comment was never posted and the Internet has eaten it! GRRRR ( ... )

inuyatta December 24 2010, 07:39:59 UTC

No worries about time--it's the holiday season, people are going to be swallowed by it ( ... )

moonspinner January 11 2011, 14:44:06 UTC

Hi, friend! Are you back? I was just re-reading our old back-and-forth and thinking it would be great to get this discussion going again.

inuyatta January 11 2011, 19:46:42 UTC

Indeed, I am! Just trying to re-adjust to my regular schedule!

amiraelizabeth December 7 2010, 23:12:41 UTC

The whole "mocking Aang" thing just irks me. I had one person tell me that because it wasn't a big deal to Aang, it really wasn't that bad. But it was. He mocked Aang's dead culture. He mocked Aang's ideas of forgiveness. He mocked Aang's ideas about not taking revenge. And only a few episodes before he wanted forgiveness and no one to take revenge on him!

I had problems with Season 3 in that I think there were too many "Zuko field-trip" episodes. That TSR was unnecessary.

moonspinner December 8 2010, 07:36:13 UTC

He mocked Aang's dead culture.
Seriously what was up with that? You are mocking a dead culture - dead
because the people who owned that culture were the victim’s of
your grandfather’s genocide. That was the single most stupid
thing I had ever seen in a show. And mocking Aang’s idea of
forgiveness and not taking revenge - what? A week after you had just
been forgiven by said person - is just... *passes out from the sheer
stupidity*

I had problems with Season 3 in that I think there were too many
"Zuko field-trip" episodes. That TSR was unnecessary.

I can never face-palm enough over Aang going off alone with Zuko to
learn fire-bending. Trust is one thing. Stupid is another. If I had
been hunted for years by some guy who suddenly had a change of heart
(after a botched Face Heel Turn), I would not be going off
alone with him anywhere. And my psychotic girl-friend who had
just privately warned this former-enemy that she did not trust
would not be letting me go off alone with him anywhere. Or at least
she’d say something against it.

amiraelizabeth December 8 2010, 23:10:50 UTC

Again, I have had people say it's no big deal and blow it off. And that to me is just indicative of people's need to excuse of gloss over everything Zuko does. And I actually like Zuko. I like the flawed, messed up, sometimes cool, sometimes a jerk Zuko.

moonspinner December 9 2010, 08:57:36 UTC

I adore Zuko. I hate the Zuko-Stu that masqueraded as the real Zuko in the latter parts of S3. I particularly hated the one that was mocking Aang for forgiveness and egging Katara on to commit murder in TSR.

amiraelizabeth December 10 2010, 03:23:33 UTC

I've had a love/hate relationship with Zuko in part because I absolutely adore Aang. Aang for me was the hook of the series and what got me watching and kept watching. I honestly really didn't care for Zuko until a few months ago. The fandom is all zuko, zuko, zuko and I think easily glosses over his actions primarily the S2 finale and beyond. He merely has issues with Katara, he mocked Aang's culture, let's forget he hired a hit man, etc.

I know you aren't terribly crazy about the lion turtle, but what did you think of Aang not wanting/not killing Ozai. I loved that he didn't.

Re: moonspinner December 10 2010, 08:31:26 UTC

I think fandom is partial to Zuko because he is older, good-looking and more crushable and generally has the whole Draco in Leather Pants thing going for him. Even better, he gets to be redeemed in the story, unlike the real Draco. That aside, the story was clearly conceptualized with Zuko and Aang as co-protagonists from the start and the writers did a very good job (until Season 3) of managing the balancing act between them. Then they, I don’t know - drank Kool-Aid, wanted to write fan fiction instead of their actual story - Fan Fiction wherein Zuko Is Always Right And Never Wrong and Treats Aang Like Crap and Never Gets Called Out On It.

”inuyatta” said that the writing team changed drastically between S2 and S3 and that explains a lot.

I know you aren't terribly crazy about the lion turtle, but what did you think of Aang not wanting/not killing Ozai. I loved that he didn't.That’s tricky. I don’t mind the Lion Turtle as a concept. I just don’t think it was introduced organically. I think the creators just woke up one morning and ( ... )

amiraelizabeth December 7 2010, 23:06:55 UTC

"One more thing--Katara's 'forgiveness' with Zuko was poorly handled. I'm glad it happened, but man, I would think she'd have been ready to forgive Zuko after he saved HER FATHER, not because he helped her on a ridiculous 'revenge' mission. That just seemed like a major regression for both of their characters in that episode."

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

misora December 8 2010, 01:08:36 UTC

Katara's 'forgiveness' with Zuko was poorly handled. I'm glad it happened, but man, I would think she'd have been ready to forgive Zuko after he saved HER FATHER, not because he helped her on a ridiculous 'revenge' mission. That just seemed like a major regression for both of their characters in that episode. I agree with you in that I feel Katara should have been more forgiving towards Zuko after he rescued BOTH her father and her brother (Sokka would've fallen off that gondola for sure) at The Boiling Rock. The end of that episode is so weird because we see her happy, reunited with Hakoda, and then in the beginning of the very next episode (TSR), she's snarking/yelling at Zuko again. WTF happened inbetween to make her hate him even more fiercely than before ( ... )

moonspinner December 8 2010, 07:25:11 UTC

The end of that episode is so weird because we see her happy,
reunited with Hakoda, and then in the beginning of the very next
episode (TSR), she's snarking/yelling at Zuko again.

Back to my theory that a bunch of different writers wrote the episodes
on different sides of the globe, at different times during the year,
and then they just tossed them up in the air and randomly selected how
to air them? Because. Yeah. As Yoda would say, “No sense, does this
make.” By all means, pimp away the fic!

I think Katara, in her unwillingness to forgive (girl's gotta lotta
issues), turns Zuko further into the bad guy by associating him
(wrongly) with the death of her mother. When Zuko figures this out, he
finally sees a way to get her to exorcise that demon - and maybe turn
a little bit of compassion his way in the process. After all, that's
his entire goal: to get her to finally be on his side.
I didn't see both of them going on their ninja mission to be a
regression for their characters. Yeah This is the problem I have with that lead up: ( ... )

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