I think the difference in the Tony and Owen vs Gwen is more about intent than moral 'absolutes'. Tony seems to be the kind of guy who has flings with people because it's fun, nothing more and nothing less. Both people involved know that and accept it and no one gets hurt. Gwen was in a committed relationship, as you said, and there was nothing innocent about it.
Now you can't really compare anyone to Anita Blake, but bear with me for a minute. Even in her case with the people she was sleeping around with all knowing about the others and, for the most part, accepting the situation, there's a reasonably strong negative reaction from the other characters and fans. I'm not going to do a Richard/Rhys comparison because this is weak enough already, but when sleeping around while involved with someone else is hurtful, it Shouldn't Be Done no matter which gender you are.
I always take protagonists cheating poorly, but casual sex still goes over better with fans when it's done by a guy, not a girl.
not tl;dr, you've seen the original post. Talk about ramble. I have it in spades.
One of the flaws in my argument is that NCIS is very much black and white, while Torchwood is all kinds of grey. Torchwood is designed to push people's buttons, while NCIS is playing to an American audience who want things right and wrong, good and bad. Tony can play around because for all his talk, he's an upstanding guy who has never (for what I've seen up to season 2) used this authority to coerce anyone sexually. Kate is the good Catholic girl who's good with guns and morally structured. Same can be said of all the NCIS team. Torchwood.... well, Owen's use of the sex spray in ep1 sort of says it all.
The Anita Blake analogy is an interesting one. I don't think that anyone can really stomach watching someone who's supposed to be a hero of the piece cheating on a partner. I think sleeping around is never going to be "accepted". Or at least, I hope.
I always take protagonists cheating poorlyWhen it comes down to it, cheating is a form of lying and
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Imagine what would happen if Tony did use sex spray and/or retconned her (him? them?) afterwards. The fallout would be hilarious.
I suppose it's also based on how accountable people are. NCIS is transparent and accountable to human laws while Torchwood is sort of alone on the frontier. They can play fast and loose as long as they stop the next apocalypse. It's not like Doctor 'there is no higher authority' Who is around much and Jack is, well, Jack.
I think that by us not knowing Owen when he pulled the sex spray thing, it was easier to later let it go (if not forgive). I think that Tony is a smarm, but he wouldn't cross that line. It's more of that black and white designation on NCIS.
You're right, NCIS is comfortably within the bounds of right and wrong. Torchwood is intentionally grey, with wacky Jack as the moral compass. And when Jack Harkness is the moral compass, god help us all.
One of the things I thought NCIS did well was the Abby/McGee relationship. For once it was the man seeking commitment, but when he didn't get it the woman wasn't demonised OR punished, and they remain friends.
Another one hooked!dotty8608June 17 2008, 14:54:35 UTC
Yay! Yet another person hooked on NCIS! I love love love this show! I just recently got into it, and so haven't seen any of the fifth seaason (but am totally saving up the money to buy it as soon as it comes out on DVD) but yeah, watched the first season and fell in love. Bought all subsequent seasons sight unseen. Not a regret one. The show, to put it plainly, rocks face.
*looks forward to some wacky NCIS crossover fics in the future*
I am very old-fashioned regarding marriage and committed relationships, especially on cheating. I don't mind casual sex, I don't even mind seeking other sexual partners with consent of the existing partners. But I WILL NOT FORGIVE anyone, no matter their gender, who cheats on their domestic partner or equivalent
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Now you can't really compare anyone to Anita Blake, but bear with me for a minute. Even in her case with the people she was sleeping around with all knowing about the others and, for the most part, accepting the situation, there's a reasonably strong negative reaction from the other characters and fans. I'm not going to do a Richard/Rhys comparison because this is weak enough already, but when sleeping around while involved with someone else is hurtful, it Shouldn't Be Done no matter which gender you are.
I always take protagonists cheating poorly, but casual sex still goes over better with fans when it's done by a guy, not a girl.
sorry, tl;dr
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One of the flaws in my argument is that NCIS is very much black and white, while Torchwood is all kinds of grey. Torchwood is designed to push people's buttons, while NCIS is playing to an American audience who want things right and wrong, good and bad. Tony can play around because for all his talk, he's an upstanding guy who has never (for what I've seen up to season 2) used this authority to coerce anyone sexually. Kate is the good Catholic girl who's good with guns and morally structured. Same can be said of all the NCIS team. Torchwood.... well, Owen's use of the sex spray in ep1 sort of says it all.
The Anita Blake analogy is an interesting one. I don't think that anyone can really stomach watching someone who's supposed to be a hero of the piece cheating on a partner. I think sleeping around is never going to be "accepted". Or at least, I hope.
I always take protagonists cheating poorlyWhen it comes down to it, cheating is a form of lying and ( ... )
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I suppose it's also based on how accountable people are. NCIS is transparent and accountable to human laws while Torchwood is sort of alone on the frontier. They can play fast and loose as long as they stop the next apocalypse. It's not like Doctor 'there is no higher authority' Who is around much and Jack is, well, Jack.
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You're right, NCIS is comfortably within the bounds of right and wrong. Torchwood is intentionally grey, with wacky Jack as the moral compass. And when Jack Harkness is the moral compass, god help us all.
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Hope you get through the first two seasons soonish, because Ziva really rocks my socks!
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*looks forward to some wacky NCIS crossover fics in the future*
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