Well, OK, Harry's destiny is a little murky. He will either kill Voldemort or be killed by Voldemort. But honestly, do you really think Rowling will surprise us with a stunningly dark subversion of the Hero myth and have Voldemort kill Harry in the end? I don't know. Maybe she will. Maybe she has an interesting angle on it. How Jossian.
Of course we still have Neville - the unexpected wild card. Does he exist to remind Harry of the twists of fate, the awkward, unnoticed Other self? Or is prophecy an even trickier thing? Neville could be the one the prophecy applied to but he's had to live without the assurances that his actions are important or remarkable. If he ever finds out about the prophecy what will his reaction be? And how will Harry's knowledge affect his own ideas of his role in all this?
Could the boy who's always played the fool turn out to be the hero of the piece? My goodness, could Neville be... Spike? [ducks and runs away]
The two wizards born at the end of JulymasqthephlsphrOctober 15 2003, 09:26:03 UTC
Ah yes, the Neville vs. Harry issue. Prophecies are tricky things. I've given this some thought, and since you bring it up, I'm going to let you have my brain dump on it
( ... )
Some observationsselenakOctober 15 2003, 13:42:29 UTC
Sirius: let me a cruel heretic and postulate it's good for Harry he died. Because Sirius in his way was just as much projecting James into Harry as Snape does, albeit for opposite reasons. And Harry was willing to be James for him, which isn't good if you have to forge your own identity.
At any rate, on one level the entire book deals with the deconstruction of the father. Harry loses the image of James-as-the-perfect-saint which has been build up through the previous volumes; he discovers his father could be a jerk and a bully as a teenager (resembling no one as much as Draco, though with the crucial difference that Draco never would have befriended Remus). He loses his godfather/replacement father Sirius, literally, but also the image of Sirius as nearly as perfect as James. (And we just know Harry will never forgive Snape for outliving both James and Sirius and destroying Harry's adoration of them, just as Snape will never forgive Harry for having seen those memories.) He loses his trust in the Über-Father of the entire saga,
( ... )
Re: Some observationsmasqthephlsphrOctober 15 2003, 13:55:45 UTC
Because Sirius in his way was just as much projecting James into Harry as Snape does, albeit for opposite reasons. And Harry was willing to be James for him, which isn't good if you have to forge your own identity.
I agree about this. Although I was happy that Harry at last had a parental figure he could actually love and respect, Sirius was looking to replace his own loss of James with Harry. What a 'shipper like myself hopes for, as I did in the case of Angel and Connor, was that the two would actually come to see each other for who they really were and love each other for who they really were. And I mourn the loss of that not happening in the case of both 'ships.
But still, it's worth observing that the "good" characters, not just the Malfoys - i.e. the Weasleys, and Sirius - take the slavery of Houseelves as the natural state of being and never question it.
And it grates on my nerves every time it happens, just as much as it grates on Hermione's. It was part of the reason I had that little mini-rant in my Goblet review.
Had an interesting conversation with Scroll a while back in her LJ about emotional heroes vs. pragmatic side characters a bit back, which sounds a bit like the Harry rushing in problem. Hermione's not quite as pragmatic as Jack and Sloan in Alias or Wesley and Giles in Buffy and Angel, but I can definitely see her getting there (esp. in darkfic, heh).
Other than that, I think the people who commented before said pretty much everything I wanted to! But yeah, very glad that Hermione's house elf campaign has been vindicated, because that part of Goblet really pissed me off.
I think it was supposed to piss you offmasqthephlsphrOctober 16 2003, 17:10:13 UTC
that part of Goblet really pissed me off
As it worried me. It was presented in Goblet uncommented on, and Hermione was somewhat presented as the fool for worrying about the elves. But if Dumbledore's comment at the end of "Phoenix" was any indication, there will be a major reckoning for the humans in terms of their treatment of the elves. Rowling just chose not to have that reckoning take place in Goblet or Phoenix, but she always intended on having the reckoning.
Hermione's not quite as pragmatic as Jack and Sloan in Alias or Wesley and Giles in Buffy and Angel, but I can definitely see her getting thereI'm thinking you're right. Hermione does the "stop, wait, think" thing and Harry ignores her. And Ron plays the loyal sidekick most of the time, "I'm with Harry." The problem with Hermione as the voice of caution that Harry really needs is that Rowling portrays her as a bit annoying and someone not to be taken seriously. So even though she's right, readers tend to blow her off just like Harry and Ron do
( ... )
Re: I think it was supposed to piss you offoyceterOctober 16 2003, 17:26:35 UTC
I think Hermione's definitely going to be vindicated, along with the rest of the "silly girls" that Harry starts out thinking not much of (Parvati and Lavender, Ginny, Luna, etc. Ok, maybe not Parvati and Lavender). I really like the idea of it all being in Harry's POV, which never hit me before. This is probably why I was so worried and angry about the house elf situation in Goblet, because before catching on, it felt very much as though Rowling the author/creator was saying "Pishposh, Hermione is silly" or something like that. Goes along with one feminist critique of the first book I read in Salon, where the writer pointed out that Harry and Ron got to be heroes while Hermione was the annoying know-it-all who still had to be saved from a troll because she fainted.
I'm thinking Harry and Ron are really going to have to start taking Hermione more seriously in future books, given where Harry's rush into it heroics have gotten him in this book.
And I can't wait for the world shattering war that's brewing in the distance.
Have you read any interviews on Rowlings' view re: feminism?masqthephlsphrOctober 16 2003, 18:34:25 UTC
I have a tendency to walk around with the naive viewpoint that all women are feminists, because people know and follow what it's their best interest. I get a big surprise when I meet women who are not
( ... )
Book RecommendationbuffyannotaterOctober 17 2003, 13:40:46 UTC
I have been loving the new series by Jim Butcher, The Dresden Files, which is a really cool mix of mystery and noir, and fantasy. It's sort of like Harry Potter and Angel were combined--it's the story of an inner-city private detective/wizard who helps out the Chicago PD on supernatural crimes. The books have everything from vampires and werewolves to fairies and wood sprites, and are a cool mix of satire and suspense, sort of, again, like a Whedon show. All genres--comedy, horror, drama, sci-fi, fantasty--converge in really cool ways. I originally heard about the series because James Marsters did the audiobooks for the first two volumes, but whether that is a turn-on or turn-off for you, the books are really good on their own merits. Got through the whole series in 3 weeks
( ... )
Yeah, I'm slowly returning to LJ-land...buffyannotaterOctober 17 2003, 17:56:31 UTC
My grandma was sick for the past few months, and died a few weeks ago. I was very close to her, so I wasn't much in a posting-mood for a while, especially not the LJ, because on the one hand I felt too down at the time to get that personal in the journal, but on the other hand felt weird talking about myself and not mentioning that. But anyway, I just saw a few movies and some Broadway shows I'm gonna want to post on, and perhaps a parallels between "Kill Bill" and "Buffy" post, if I have the time.
Comments 19
Of course we still have Neville - the unexpected wild card. Does he exist to remind Harry of the twists of fate, the awkward, unnoticed Other self? Or is prophecy an even trickier thing? Neville could be the one the prophecy applied to but he's had to live without the assurances that his actions are important or remarkable. If he ever finds out about the prophecy what will his reaction be? And how will Harry's knowledge affect his own ideas of his role in all this?
Could the boy who's always played the fool turn out to be the hero of the piece? My goodness, could Neville be... Spike? [ducks and runs away]
;)
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At any rate, on one level the entire book deals with the deconstruction of the father. Harry loses the image of James-as-the-perfect-saint which has been build up through the previous volumes; he discovers his father could be a jerk and a bully as a teenager (resembling no one as much as Draco, though with the crucial difference that Draco never would have befriended Remus). He loses his godfather/replacement father Sirius, literally, but also the image of Sirius as nearly as perfect as James. (And we just know Harry will never forgive Snape for outliving both James and Sirius and destroying Harry's adoration of them, just as Snape will never forgive Harry for having seen those memories.) He loses his trust in the Über-Father of the entire saga, ( ... )
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I agree about this. Although I was happy that Harry at last had a parental figure he could actually love and respect, Sirius was looking to replace his own loss of James with Harry. What a 'shipper like myself hopes for, as I did in the case of Angel and Connor, was that the two would actually come to see each other for who they really were and love each other for who they really were. And I mourn the loss of that not happening in the case of both 'ships.
But still, it's worth observing that the "good" characters, not just the Malfoys - i.e. the Weasleys, and Sirius - take the slavery of Houseelves as the natural state of being and never question it.
And it grates on my nerves every time it happens, just as much as it grates on Hermione's. It was part of the reason I had that little mini-rant in my Goblet review.
In ( ... )
Reply
Other than that, I think the people who commented before said pretty much everything I wanted to! But yeah, very glad that Hermione's house elf campaign has been vindicated, because that part of Goblet really pissed me off.
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As it worried me. It was presented in Goblet uncommented on, and Hermione was somewhat presented as the fool for worrying about the elves. But if Dumbledore's comment at the end of "Phoenix" was any indication, there will be a major reckoning for the humans in terms of their treatment of the elves. Rowling just chose not to have that reckoning take place in Goblet or Phoenix, but she always intended on having the reckoning.
Hermione's not quite as pragmatic as Jack and Sloan in Alias or Wesley and Giles in Buffy and Angel, but I can definitely see her getting thereI'm thinking you're right. Hermione does the "stop, wait, think" thing and Harry ignores her. And Ron plays the loyal sidekick most of the time, "I'm with Harry." The problem with Hermione as the voice of caution that Harry really needs is that Rowling portrays her as a bit annoying and someone not to be taken seriously. So even though she's right, readers tend to blow her off just like Harry and Ron do ( ... )
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I'm thinking Harry and Ron are really going to have to start taking Hermione more seriously in future books, given where Harry's rush into it heroics have gotten him in this book.
And I can't wait for the world shattering war that's brewing in the distance.
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