In which Geoffrey Robertson basically calls the Vatican a rogue state

[maradydd]

Well may the pope defy "the petty gossip of dominant opinion". But the Holy See can no longer ignore international law, which now counts the widespread or systematic sexual abuse of children as a crime against humanity. The anomalous claim of the Vatican to be a state - and of the pope to be a head of state and hence immune from legal action -

Comments

[maradydd]

Yeah. I'm currently reading through the Rome Statute (the document that defines the ICC and how it works) to find out whether the fact that the Vatican isn't a signatory to the Rome Statute matters or not, and I just stumbled across something you might find interesting in another context, with regard to the definition of 'crimes against humanity':‘Enforced disappearance of persons’ means the arrest, detention or abduction of persons by, or with the authorization, support or acquiescence of, a State or a political organization, followed by a refusal to acknowledge that deprivation of freedom or to give information on the fate or whereabouts of those persons, with the intention of removing them from the protection of the law for a prolonged period of time.

[maradydd]

Statute of Rome, articles 12 and 13: since crimes were committed on UK soil against UK citizens, the ICC may exercise jurisdiction if the UK refers the situation to the Prosecutor.

[derekja]

And Richard Dawkins is trying to have the pope arrested for it on his forthcoming visit: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article7094310.ece

[maradydd]

Bit cheeky of the headline writer to impute that Dawkins intends to do the arresting himself, but yeah, saw that too.

[lightning_rose]

It turns out that's not quite what Dawkins said.

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/04/you_cant_trust_a_murdoch_paper.php

[ndgmtlcd]

This is the perfect time for this to happen. The current pope is a wiz in canonical law as well as theology and the history of the church. Previous popes were rather innocent in these matters. This means that he'll look for legal precedent, among many things. He doesn't have many options. The Templars aren't around anymore so he's short of scapegoats.

In theory he could take all the blame upon himself and "retire":

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/11/weekinreview/11wakin.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papal_abdication

[lightning_rose]

I think it's more likely he'll be found one morning dead in his bed. After all, he *is* 84 years old and without an autopsy, well, we'll never know for sure, will we?

[paka]

Having the Church as a sovereign nation working within the bounds of earthly power to maintain the legal safety of its representatives just seems - really invalidating of their claim to be spiritually anything.

There isn't even a clear equivalent connection between Israel's government and Judaism, nor Saudi Arabia's government and Islam. And you'd think that the equivalent strongly hierarchical Orthodox churches still have their priests, up to the highest level, subject to Russian, Greek, Serbian and Ethiopian civil law. Why is it that this single organization gets away with what no other religious group in the world can do?

And why are they so fixated on protecting the wrongdoers within their own ranks, anyway? Common wisdom is that, when you're facing a PR disaster over stuff which can be easily proven, you attempt to make yourself look good not by clumsily covering things over or screaming about persecution, but by admitting that stuff has been messed up and by trying to be very visible about fixing things.

[digitalusrex]

down with the pope!