bedroom in a bell tower; trans* in seminary?

[miscellanium]

I'm writing a story set in Ronceverte, West Virginia, sometime during or after the 1970s, and want to use the town's Catholic church as the main stage

Comments

[green_grrl]

Small or large, most Catholic churches do not contain residential quarters. The priest lives in the rectory, a separate building. And I can't imagine anything other than stairs in the bell tower. (Aside from the size, those things are flipping LOUD.)

[lied_ohne_worte]

And they might shake/vibrate whenever the bell rings, as well as not having proper insulation

[dorsetgirl]

+1 to all this.

people's perception of their status

This is a very important point. Even in Protestant churches the vicar/rector/whatever generally has high status - vicarages and rectories built in the 18th/19th centuries are huge - and my impression is that a Catholic priest is another step up from that. You can't be "Father" to an entire parish if you're stashed away in a tiny bedsit in the bell tower.

[lied_ohne_worte]

True. I'm mostly familiar with rural rectories (having grown up in one), and the really old ones, from the time when there was an actual farm associated with it, would have had not only the main house itself, but also stable and barn, although those often didn't make it into modern times or were converted into assembly rooms. The rectory wouldn't have been as big as the biggest farms, but large enough to make clear to all that there's an person of consequence living there. The one I grew up in, from the mid-19th century, was considerably bigger than the houses around it. These should mostly be rectories from German-language countries; note the size difference between them and that bell tower, and also the fact that they tend to have a nice, wide front and in quite a few cases stairs that people have to go up, with all the associations that come with that. From my country's statistics, those should be half/half Protestant and Catholic.

And apart from the stylistic differences (oh, some of those are nice!), the sizes of the English-

[channonyarrow]

Seminaries are generally graduate institutes. Consequently, the transcripts that your character has to provide in order to be accepted into a program of study may inadvertently reveal his gender. You may wish to pick a seminary, research their requirements, then pick an undergrad and research its - all within the context of the 70s, when forms were different. But to be very blunt about it, at some point in that process, your character almost certainly had to provide government id. Unless his id matches his gender, it ain't gonna work out well. You could, in theory, have him doctor up a bunch of fake transcripts, but as an editor I'd have to wonder why you were so intent on having this character commit criminal acts to do something that would be pretty atypical for the time, in an organisation that is totally unwelcoming to gender identity issues.

[miscellanium]

thanks for the editorial perspective. i was checking on the seminary because my understanding is that people cannot become priests, assigned to parishes, etc., without going to seminary. part of the story is predicated on the (theoretical) visual appeal/contrast of the clerical collar vs. story events, but i suppose i could take another look and decide that things could just as easily be managed if he were not actually clergy but rather just very religious. (or he could be posing as a priest, but then that raises a whole other set of questions wrt the diocese and its organization that would likely take the story in a quite different direction.)

[lied_ohne_worte]

Seminary is only part of it; they need to do a full course of studying Catholic Theology/Divinity/whatever it's called depending on country as a requirement; just being religious and going to seminary isn't enough. And I suspect that those studies, particularly the bureaucratic requirements for them, might make it difficult for the original idea of keeping the transgender part secret.

Even if it was possible to go through with it, he'd be taking a very great risk - if he was discovered at any point, even years later, he would be thrown out and probably wouldn't be able to find any employment in any space controlled by the church. It would be an extremely unsafe existence, especially economically.

[miscellanium]

right, i understand about the studies. this is making me consider more seriously dropping the clergy aspect, but this is still all very good to know.

speaking from research and personal experience, the risk aspect doesn't seem like a big deterrent to me; it would be an unsafe existence no matter what.

[lied_ohne_worte]

Well, from recent reports from here and other countries, there might well be gay sex taking place in seminaries - and Austrian one was closed about that and other, much worse issues. An ex-priest in Germany has written a book about the contrast between the church's official stance on homosexuality, which seems to become more and more unyielding, and the fact that a considerable number of priests are gay (he cites a study talking about 20 to 40 percent in the US and estimates the percentage in Germany to be higher) - and by far not all of them live a celibate life, with the hierarchy tacitly accepting it. There's an English-language article linked in the one I linked to, if you're interested. One also hears rumours of group sauna visits etc. - so, all in all, your character would probably do well to stay a bit aloof from his fellows in order not to get into accidental embarrassing situations

[alextiefling]

Wandering around Google Maps, it looks like there's a large parish house, the same age and architectural style as the church, to the north of it. I'd be willing to bet that this is the Parish House, and that the priest lives there. Apart from housing a priest and possibly a housekeeper, it might well also be where the priest conducts those parts of his ministry which aren't best done in the church. The windowed room in the bell tower is probably the ringing chamber.

My only question about your trans* seminarian is: how will he handle his supply and consumption of medication? Other than that, I would expect it could be done.

[alextiefling]

Ack - missed the 1970s aspect. I think a transman with 1970s technology might have great difficulty passing for 7 years in close quarters, sadly. And the point made above about academic records becomes relevant, since there would be no jurisdiction in which those might be legally changed to reflect a male gender.

[lied_ohne_worte]

it might well also be where the priest conducts those parts of his ministry which aren't best done in the church

Exactly. From movie portrayals, it seems to be a common misconception that priests/Reverends are constantly in their church building and do most of their work there, and that's really not true, for a number of reasons.

[miscellanium]

oh, thanks for the parish house catch! it's hard for me to navigate google maps on my computer, but it sounds like it'll be worth the struggle this go round. (the windowed room did throw me off.)

to reply to your other comment - i'm not devoted to the 1970s setting, but my understanding is that HRT and surgeries, if the character so chooses, were both available at the time. are there shared dormitory rooms where students are required to stay, or does this vary from institute to institute?

will think on the academic records.

[akcipitrokulo]

Most of churches I've know have had the priests' house as part of same building, like an annexe that was built at the same time.

I don't think it would be very feasible unless he was stealing someone else's identity because he would need a baptism certificate (probably as infant), and proof of first communion and confirmation (around 7years old and 12 years old respectively).