Royal titulary and random religous questions

[rohaa]

Where: Egypt

Comments

[irene_adler]

Horus-in-the-Nest. I can't give authority for it offhand, but I have heard it. (Former archaeology major here

[irene_adler]

Also, don't be afraid to use Egyptian words as names, if they have the proper termination. I've always wanted to call a character Sebat (f. "star"). One otherwise lovely Egyptian historical novel has a lady named Nefernefernefer, literally, "beautiful, beautiful, beautiful." But there's the perfectly historical name Nefret for a woman, and the name "beauties," plural, is Neferu, a man's name.

(And you probably know that the transliteration is an authorial preference already.)

[rohaa]

Thanks, I've been doing exactly that, which is why I've depleted the standard name-and-baby sites. There's only so many names in there that are useful (unless you wanna go firstborn, secondborn, etc on till infinity), and I think I've used almost all ;) And I don't trust half those sites, if I see how they butching up Dutch names, for example ;)

[rohaa]

Ohh I can work with this. *nods* I'll have to experiment with throwing some of those prefixes in front of other words and names <3

I've tried googles on other titulary for the area but haven't been very successful. I'll look into those sort of lists you mentioned though, sounds interesting.

Thank you!!

[nina_vendredi]

If you are so inclined to purchase reference materials, this book, has a full chapter on Egyptian names. It's organized by culture, and the index lists meanings, and their associated names.

[rohaa]

Lovely icon!

Thanks for the link, I think I may in fact be thus inclined! Got more while I"m at it? :P

[nina_vendredi]

Thank you. (This is where I pimp the manga, Saiyuki; a somewhat bloody retelling of Journey to the West, which is where the image comes from.)

I don't have the names of books of names off the top of my head, but I'm usually good for random reference books. Did you have anything else in mind?

[rohaa]

Sadly, I'm not a walking wiki :( I have a few cheap egyptish books but I've found quality of knowledge in most books i see to be rather, um, crappy. Blablabla pyramid blabla King TUT OMG!!! but nothing in my time period. :(

Haha hell rocks xD

I hope this helps

[rodlox]

"Pharaoh" was the Hebrew pronounciation of "Per-aa" (The Great House), actually; but since that was used on conjunction with the imperial name, no harm no foul)

1. What to call the Heir Apparent? He is the eldest son, and co-ruler with his father. I need a title that would be used to address him, either appropriate to the time period, or translated in more modern use (like I did with King). I have been using Pharaoh-Heir, but obviously that won't work now.
Well, besides, Prince,

2. What to call courtiers, governors of separate nomen, younger princes, sons by concubines that are NOT princes, royal advisors, etc etc? Once again, looking for titles, not descriptions.
Oh. I thought all princes were "Prince" until one or another became King. (probably too much Ottoman study on my brain, sorry)

the courtiers and governors and courtiers can probably be called by (in addition to their name/title), where they're from.

3. Is there any evidence of gods speaking to their followers? Would they speak only to priests, or also others? If they

Re: I hope this helps

[rohaa]

Haha I love this Egyptian way of not including vowels...not. I see all these sites go ght lst pwts, and I've no clue what to make of it ;)

I LIKE Re'neb :) I like Weret, too.

As for the princes, most heir-apparents have special titles to show their status as definitive next king/queen, and especially in this case where the heir-apparent has been happily co-regent with the King for 10 years already. So hard to find the proper titles for that, and I'm obsessed with staying historically acurate and not just making up a title for him. For the lower guys, hey, if there's no knowledge available on the topic, what's to say I'm wrong? :P

Will see if I can dig up that book, thank you!

[pocketmouse]

I can't recall much about it, and my notebooks aren't really readily to hand, but in one of my Egypt art history classes in college, one of the pieces we studied was a horus-head, part of a life-size puppet that priests would wear/control so it looked like it was moving and speaking to someone. I can try and dig up more about it if you'd like, off the top of my head I can't even remember what period it was from, but there's something to start with for #3. I bet if they did it with Horus they did it with others.

[rohaa]

w00t Q!! Wouldn't he come in handy xD

I'd love anything you could dig up, if of course it's not too much trouble for you <3

Thankies!

Anonymous back from the dead?

[anonymous]

Hello! I'm so so sorry for disappearing on you like that! About a two days after we talked my laptop started erasing all my documents and stuff for no reason at all until it crashed irreparably. I've had to send it to a shop to get it fixed and now I can only use the 'net at the library. I've also had a frantic few weeks trying to redo all the essays and stuff I lost so I haven't been around, really sorry! After I did all that work on your story as well! Hopefully, most of it should be recoverable (or so the technician guy tells me

Gods and Assassins

[anonymous]

3. he issue of gods talking to humans was a complicated one. The king was meant to be the result of a kings wife being impregnated by a god (Ra in the fifth dynasty) his mother was also depicted as becoming a god (usually either Isis or Hathor) so this would be an obvious starting point. However the Egyptians were very aware that this technically didn't happen, that their king was human. This resulted in a very delicate balance and tied in nicely with the duality obsession Egyptians had. Gods typically talk to kings, Hatshepsut and Tuthmosis III both claimed that Amun had spoken to them at Karnak saying they were rightful kings. Whether they blatantly made these claims up for propaganda reasons or whether they believed they did hear voices is unknown and the method the gods used to speak to them isn't mentioned in texts. Tuthmosis III also claimed that at the opening rituals of a temple the 'revered god Amun desired to do the extending of the line himself

Re: Gods and Assassins

[rohaa]

They would stand on open platforms singing hymns and prayers to the sky.

I can totally see this happening xD Beautiful! I'm perfectly ok with just priests talking to gods, or Pharaohs.

I would LOVE that letter from the paranoid murderous king, sounds like someone familiar? *drools*

Mmmm not so happy with asshole pharaohs, though it serves me alright...*plotplotplot*

if the king survives he is protected, if he is dead the gods have abandoned him.

Awesome!

Sorry for teh short, just realized I have to runnnnn! THANK YOU!!

Gods and Assassins

[anonymous]

3. The issue of gods talking to humans was a complicated one. The king was meant to be the result of a kings wife being impregnated by a god (Ra in the fifth dynasty) his mother was also depicted as becoming a god (usually either Isis or Hathor) so this would be an obvious starting point. However the Egyptians were very aware that this technically didn't happen, that their king was human. This resulted in a very delicate balance and tied in nicely with the duality obsession Egyptians had. Gods typically talk to kings, Hatshepsut and Tuthmosis III both claimed that Amun had spoken to them at Karnak saying they were rightful kings. Whether they blatantly made these claims up for propaganda reasons or whether they believed they did hear voices is unknown and the method the gods used to speak to them isn't mentioned in texts. Tuthmosis III also claimed that at some temples opening rituals of a temple the 'revered god Amun desired to do the extending of the line himself