No Point Complaining About Obama if We Don't Elect a Republican Congress

[jordan179]

There is no point complaining about Obama and his Administration unless we are going to elect a Republican Congress this year.

It's obvious by now that not only does Obama not take the hint that he is overstepping his Constitutional authority, but that he actually revels in doing so, because he sees the Constitutional limits on his office as a

Comments

[galadrion]

I doubt our country will really be in much deeper trouble than it is already; November 22nd, 1963 didn't destroy the country, and neither will whatever date the nutjob that takes out the Second Camelot Sponsor succeeds on. And I'm sad to say that I'm considering the possibility more and more likely - from his actions, it almost looks like Obama has been courting martyrdom... although he also appears to not believe that it's possible that it could happen to him. After all, is he not the Lightbringer?

Meh, not really going anywhere with this. It's just that it's 3:30 in the morning, and I'm not awake enough to follow what passes for a liberal's reasoning.

[jordan179]

November 22nd, 1963 didn't destroy the country, and neither will whatever date the nutjob that takes out the Second Camelot Sponsor succeeds on.

Three Presidents were assassinated before Kennedy. And I so deeply do not want to see Obama made into a martyr, a blank slate onto which the Millennials and Homelanders can write whatever ideal personality they .
wish he had.

Anyway, even if someone attempting to assassinate Obama would be a good thing (which it wouldn't be) it probably wouldn't work. Most assassination attempts fail.

It certainly wouldn't act as a deterrent to future tyrants. They'd simply draw the lesson "have tighter security." Only the rejection of Obama and his Administration can deter others from following in his course.

[galadrion]

Even that rejection wouldn't prevent the next one from the same course. The people in the offices aren't the ones determining the course. The President, Congresscritters... they haven't been the ones determining policy in more than half a century.

Jordan, I know you're a fairly avid sci-fi reader. Have you read Spider Robinson's Very Hard Choices? If so, what did you think of the premise? (If not, I'd recommend it... just so I could hear what you think of it.)

[jordan179]

The people in the offices aren't the ones determining the course. The President, Congresscritters... they haven't been the ones determining policy in more than half a century.

Then who is, and what prevents the people in the offices from "determining the course," given that they are the ones actually authorized to issue lawful orders regarding that course? Yes, I know about the Evil Faceless Bureaurcats, but almost all the important agencies are Executive Branch, and the laws under which they operate are passed by the Legislative Branch and interprted by the Judiciary.

In particular, the President has hire, fire and/or assignment power over every single freaking person in the Executive Branch agencies: if Mr. Big Influential IRS or CIA executive does something the President doesn't like, that person may well find himself supervising agency functions in Little America, Antarctica. The claim that the President "really" has no control over them is useful FOR THE PRESIDENT when he's ordered them to do something illegal and wants to

[kharmii]

If Obama doesn't get challenged, it will tear this country apart. I already see signs everywhere of people being angry enough to start a civil war, or at least try to vote to break away from the major cities.

[gothelittle]

The part I find interesting is that there are many, many people who are not starting civil war, not talking about breaking away from major cities... in fact, many of them probably live in major cities... but they are simply starting to *ignore* the various edicts

[belvarius]

"It may be that Obama and his favored liberals will be rejected by the American people by simple, non-violent refusal to comply."

One can hope, I certainly do! However, I do fear Kharmii is right about the level of anger in places. I fear that if things don't start getting better soon, say within a decade to 15 years, we may see some states make serious attempts to secede. I expect Texas will lead the way on that since they've made so much noise about it. Should that happen I don't doubt it will be long before my state, Oklahoma, attempts to join them.

[oxymoron02]

The apathy of Americans towards following the rules, towing the line and maintaining the status quo makes me happy. I recently heard the argument that if deporting illegal immigrants can't happen because there are just too many to track down, process and prosecute, what happens when enough of us stand up and just say no to *pick an issue*?

I'm really trying not to give up hope on the political process, but both sides seem to just grow government. Admittedly different pet programs and public interests, but at this point does it really matter which agency is getting a budget increase? One side pays lip service to that group, the other to its opposition, both offer the solution of expanding government to fix the problem.

[banner]

The problem is, the GOP establishment is totally supporting Obama and are no different than the democrats. So unless there is a republican who is supported by the Tea Party in my area, I will not be voting for any Republicans at all.

The sooner it all collaspes and dies in a fire, the happier I'll be. Because the Republic is dead.

[eta_ta]

agree.

[justgoto]

Sadly, I also think this is true.

[jordan179]

Do you really want to see the Republic fall? It won't be nice, it won't be pretty, it will probably take the form of several coups, civil wars and persecutions of the political opposition (different ones, depending on who's winning at the moment, and by "persecution" I mean "take them out and shoot them," not "deny them career advancement"). And when it's over, we'll be a military dictatorship in all but name.

That would be better than the leadership Obama is providing, but not better than Constitutional government of the sort I've known most of my life.

[eta_ta]

there is another option that you seem to undervalue: formation of a third party with gradual rise in importance and final substitution of Republican.
see Gallup: self-identification with (R) is 25-yr low.

I hope so.
(R) compromised themselves by their record of betraying their base. To vote for them is flagging a dead horse.

[jordan179]

Third parties rarely work if the lead party is strongly organized, as the Democrats are right now. What usually happens is that they split the vote and the lead party wins the election. If that happens in 2016, the Republic may really be over -- I think that by 2020 the electoral system would be so badly compromised that come 2021, military leaders would for real start eyeing the roads to Washington DC.

[jsl32]

sorry, you're wrong on this one, and the people mentioning the unelected bureaucracy are right. it starts with making those guys uncomfortable, because they are at the state and local levels making it impossible to live normally. the politicians are not really the biggest problem right now. the whole dang country could be democrat-only and it would be better if the bureaucrats actually behaved like civil servants rather than petty tyrants with a pension.

[jordan179]

I don't see any way for people who want to support the Constitution to "make those guys uncomfortable" without committing crimes and putting themselves right where the totalitarians want us to be -- namely, objectively guilty of what most people would consider serious crimes.

[ford_prefect42]

By supporting the constitution, and challenging their ability to do their jobs in the court, complete with personal lawsuits for their rampant abuses of power.

[jsl32]

there are all kinds of ways long before you get to committing crimes.

it's quite disappointing that you can't think of any possible way to make a bureaucrat whose workplace is public and unguarded uncomfortable that isn't "crime".

they are paper tigers. they can't be voted out, but they can be made to actually serve the public or quit, and all without being "criminal" in the eyes of most people (even most liberal people).