Trenzalore as the field of battle where the final act of the Time War was played out, where the Doctor committed the act that saw 8 die and 9 regenerated, the location of the Doctors worst secret - when he committed genocide on his own people?
I would like to think that it's going to be something like that, with a bit of lore and weight and build-up behind it, rather than something Moffat's just pulled out of his, er, his hat having invented it from whole cloth.
Agreed - if it's something new that just comes out of leftfield now, it means nothing.
They do, don't they? Interesting. I just hope they have more to do in the story than look scary in the shot for the trailer - unlike, say, the monsters in The Rings of Akhaten (still my least favourite episode of the current run).
That one soldier didn't half look like James Corden, didn't he? Right? I couldn't stop thinking about how much he looked like Craig. :P
Fenric could have told s/he/it that the Doctor always cheats at chess... hehe
I agree that it was a very solid episode, and that it really made its more whimsical elements work, although it wasn't as completely fantastic as "The Doctor's Wife." I think what that one had going for it was that in addition to being a great episode, it tapped into a lot of "Doctor-Who-ness," and I think this was less of a meta-episode.
Seriouly. I mean, it wasn't him, but for a moment I wondered.
That's why they call it the "game of traps" (and there was a bit of a reference to that bit from Fenric in Eleven's dialogue, I thought - but I do tend to see Seven references everywhere, so could just be me).
I would tend to agree - I think "The Doctor's Wife" was really Gaiman's big "statement" about Doctor Who, into which he put all of his love and fannish passion, whereas this was more of a straightforward story. But it was a very good story, nonetheless.
Oh, don't get me wrong, I thought it was really good, but I sort of fell in love very quickly with The Doctor's Wife. Impossible act to follow, and very wise of Gaiman not really to try. But yes, a very good story imho and I agree with regard to the Cybermen - as I was trying to say in my witterings above, I think it was a good idea to take a step back and approach them again from a completely different angle. It certainly showed how, with the possible exception of the "head" in The Pandorica Opens, the new series has been misusing them up to now.
Every time they mentioned the "Cyberiad", though, I was thinking it sounded like it should be some sort of epic poem or something. An epic Cyberpoem. ;)
Are you saying you're trying to compare TDW with NiS? Because that's daft! They're two entirely different stories. As I said to someone else on my FList last night, that's like comparing apples and bananas. It does not compute. Or as Spock would say, "Highly illogical, Captain". I could understand if Gaiman had written two Cybermen eps, but he hasn't, so why compare? Both stories, for me, are brilliant in their own (different) ways.
LOL Yes, I know what you mean, that thought crossed my mind too!
Not really comparing the stories, as such, but when I saw The Doctor's Wife it really hit me, like "whoah, that was great! I loved that!" and I don't think this story did that for me. Although I liked it and admired it, I don't think I felt it on the same kind of gut-level, but then arguably The Doctor's Wife and its subject matter were always going to have that effect on long-time fans. But as you say, the only real similarity between the two stories is that they were both scripted by the same writer and they both take a somewhat off-beat approach to the subject matter that ends up working a lot better than you think it's going to when you first start watching them. Having said that, there are inevitably going to be comparisons just because of who the author is and how well-received his first story was. Pointless they may ultimately be, but it's a natural enough reaction from a fannish point of view.
'Willow' underrated? I thought everybody loved it!
I found Eleven's "tight skirt" comment more um, leery, than romantic. I think they should have cut that.
I was happy with this episode though, starting with a deliberate Chess Player ref and Waxworks(?) which makes the bloke out of 'Being Human' Caligari? putting me in a good mood for the rest of it. Felt like watching a film instead of an episode, fully realised but not realised at the same time.
I liked the feeling sorry for who has to push the button line too & the castle. Would be nice to see Warwick Davis again.
Everybody I know does, the few that've seen it, but I've seen some disparaging remarks about it around the 'webz. I don't care - I think it's ace. ;D
Wasn't it just? And it didn't even seem in-character for Eleven either, so I don't know what they were thinking there.
Indeed - I was sucked in by the obvious reference to the Chess-playing Turk, one of my favourite items of weird historical trivia. It was, as you say, very self-contained and self-consistent in the way that the best-thought-out stories usually are.
And yes, maybe they can get Warwick Davis back some time - I'd like to see more of him and of the character.
Dave Who? I think it's either that or his first name really is Doctor. ;D
That's my favourite suggestion as of right now. Although I did like another idea I saw that it really is "John Smith", because of One's library card in Vampires in Venice. ;D
I enjoyed this. Smith did a good job alternating between the Doctor and the Cyberplanner.
I could do without the Doctor making overly sexual comments. As I said on Tumblr re: his kissing Jenny inappropriately (whereupon she justly slapped him), that was a bit like the Eighth Doctor kissing Grace a few times just because he was thrilled with life, and he has a raunchy sense of humor at this point, but I'm unsure he'd know what to do with actual sex if it walked up to him, kissed him back, and stripped him off. *grin* He likes to tease, but seems very awkward. I noticed that, after he made that end comment about Clara's tight skirt, he looked a bit unsettled, as if suspecting the Cyberplanner might still be in his head somewhere.
I loved Warwick Davis as Porridge. I think I've managed to miss watching Willow ever since it came out, but as I did that with Labyrinth (with David Bowie and Jennifer Connelly) and just recently fixed my mistake, I hope to do that with Willow, too.
Yes, did Smith did well, putting my mocking his impersonations aside for a moment. He pretty much always does, mind you.
I think that's my attitude - I could live without it. I thought the fannish response to the Jenny thing, while he was clearly acting inappropriately, was slightly overblown, tbh - the slap was a fair payoff for that, I thought. But I thought that that sort of comment felt a bit out of place, even with Eleven's previous somewhat adolescent attitude to sex etc taken into account. I wonder whether it was Gaiman's or Moffat's contribution?
Warwick Davis was great, I agree, and while Willow probably isn't the best film ever made (in fact, definitely isn't), I like it. It's well worth a watch if you get the chance and I hope you'll enjoy it.
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Hey, we could both be right. :)
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These new bad guys in the trailer sure as hell look like some sort of slightly evolved Silence though, don't they?
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They do, don't they? Interesting. I just hope they have more to do in the story than look scary in the shot for the trailer - unlike, say, the monsters in The Rings of Akhaten (still my least favourite episode of the current run).
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Right? I couldn't stop thinking about how much he looked like Craig. :P
Fenric could have told s/he/it that the Doctor always cheats at chess...
hehe
I agree that it was a very solid episode, and that it really made its more whimsical elements work, although it wasn't as completely fantastic as "The Doctor's Wife." I think what that one had going for it was that in addition to being a great episode, it tapped into a lot of "Doctor-Who-ness," and I think this was less of a meta-episode.
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That's why they call it the "game of traps" (and there was a bit of a reference to that bit from Fenric in Eleven's dialogue, I thought - but I do tend to see Seven references everywhere, so could just be me).
I would tend to agree - I think "The Doctor's Wife" was really Gaiman's big "statement" about Doctor Who, into which he put all of his love and fannish passion, whereas this was more of a straightforward story. But it was a very good story, nonetheless.
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Every time they mentioned the "Cyberiad", though, I was thinking it sounded like it should be some sort of epic poem or something. An epic Cyberpoem. ;)
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LOL Yes, I know what you mean, that thought crossed my mind too!
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I found Eleven's "tight skirt" comment more um, leery, than romantic. I think they should have cut that.
I was happy with this episode though, starting with a deliberate Chess Player ref and Waxworks(?) which makes the bloke out of 'Being Human' Caligari? putting me in a good mood for the rest of it. Felt like watching a film instead of an episode, fully realised but not realised at the same time.
I liked the feeling sorry for who has to push the button line too & the castle. Would be nice to see Warwick Davis again.
Next week: he's called Dave.
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Wasn't it just? And it didn't even seem in-character for Eleven either, so I don't know what they were thinking there.
Indeed - I was sucked in by the obvious reference to the Chess-playing Turk, one of my favourite items of weird historical trivia. It was, as you say, very self-contained and self-consistent in the way that the best-thought-out stories usually are.
And yes, maybe they can get Warwick Davis back some time - I'd like to see more of him and of the character.
Dave Who? I think it's either that or his first name really is Doctor. ;D
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Lol or Doc Tor.
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I could do without the Doctor making overly sexual comments. As I said on Tumblr re: his kissing Jenny inappropriately (whereupon she justly slapped him), that was a bit like the Eighth Doctor kissing Grace a few times just because he was thrilled with life, and he has a raunchy sense of humor at this point, but I'm unsure he'd know what to do with actual sex if it walked up to him, kissed him back, and stripped him off. *grin* He likes to tease, but seems very awkward. I noticed that, after he made that end comment about Clara's tight skirt, he looked a bit unsettled, as if suspecting the Cyberplanner might still be in his head somewhere.
I loved Warwick Davis as Porridge. I think I've managed to miss watching Willow ever since it came out, but as I did that with Labyrinth (with David Bowie and Jennifer Connelly) and just recently fixed my mistake, I hope to do that with Willow, too.
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I think that's my attitude - I could live without it. I thought the fannish response to the Jenny thing, while he was clearly acting inappropriately, was slightly overblown, tbh - the slap was a fair payoff for that, I thought. But I thought that that sort of comment felt a bit out of place, even with Eleven's previous somewhat adolescent attitude to sex etc taken into account. I wonder whether it was Gaiman's or Moffat's contribution?
Warwick Davis was great, I agree, and while Willow probably isn't the best film ever made (in fact, definitely isn't), I like it. It's well worth a watch if you get the chance and I hope you'll enjoy it.
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