Where's the Sucre?

[thelana]

There is something I've been wondering about for a while. Basically, where's the Sucre fic? Again, I'm not really suggesting anything, for starters, I'm not writing any nor can I really say for sure that I would definitely fall all over myself to read it if one was posted. Still, I wonder. Sucre seems to be well liked enough. He has a decent amount

Comments

[happywriter06]

I think it's more a threshold thing than anything else in regards to why most people don't write him. I could be wrong. I mean think this fandom has been good on the issues of race. Most of the fic I've read that feature him, he doesn't speak Spanish. LJ and Vee are good characters and they get written about more. He really only has relationship with Michael and as you said, there is a lot of fic about their relationship even if it's mostly slash

[thelana]

I've always had this theory that fanfiction can be unintentionally pretty hierarchical. Let's say Michael or Michael and Lincoln are the main characters. Characters like LJ, Veronica and Michael and Lincoln's parents are interesting to us because even as people write about them, they usually also say something about the main character(s) and reflect back on them. Same of some other popular characters, like Sara or Mahone. They have the potential to give insight into the characters you can't get from any others

[happywriter06]

After reading wanton_erato post, I'd have to agree that what you see is what you get with Sucre. He's rather uncomplicated even with his past. His past can be explored but I think there's only so many ways to tell his story. And since he only has relationships with Michael and Mariflooze, there's only so many stories you can tell. That goes back to what you said about fanfiction being unintentionally pretty hierarchical.

I would say it's like Michael and Lincoln are the roots of a tree, rather than being hierarchical. I mean that's how it works in my head. There's so many branches to explore because of how they relate to so many characters. Sucre doesn't have that.

[wanton_erato]

A couple of your 'whys' popped out at me

[thelana]

I've always found the dislike for Maricruz quite interesting. Like, I doubt people really like Aldo or T-Bag's love interest Susan all that much, but I have seen people explore them in fanfic, mostly for the sake of the character they do like. So one would think if somebody love Sucre first they would explore his family or Maricruz just as a way of exploring him and his personality (even if that meant portraying her in a negative way, it could still tell us something about him as a person).

Re: Kellerman. I got the impression that there was a decent following for Kellerman/Sara, some, if few, Kellerman/Michael and a decent amount of Gen on him (sometimes including his relationship with the evil president).

[wanton_erato]

So one would think if somebody love Sucre first they would explore his family or Maricruz just as a way of exploring him and his personality (even if that meant portraying her in a negative way, it could still tell us something about him as a person).

I don't think it's a case of not "loving" Sucre; I think it's a case of just not finding him that complex, or having much to get your teeth into. That's my take on it anyway.

Re: Kellerman. I got the impression that there was a decent following for Kellerman/Sara, some, if few, Kellerman/Michael and a decent amount of Gen on him (sometimes including his relationship with the evil president).

Ah, yes, Kellerman/Sara. I dislike Sara intensely as a character, so I expect I mentally blocked out any K/S fic (how dare she put her paws on the Magnificent Bastard ;) ). There's only a little M/K slash (much as I love it), and I don't recall that much gen, but I dare say you're right.

[thelana]

I did a quick character search on pbfic.net and it has 18 pages for Kellerman and 14 for Sucre, so it seems that there isn't that much of a difference (of course from that we can't tell whether their characters played a significant role).

I don't think it's a case of not "loving" Sucre; I think it's a case of just not finding him that complex, or having much to get your teeth into. That's my take on it anyway.The thing is, I get the impression sometimes fanfiction can *make* a character. Like a minor character gets huge popularity in fanfic because people write or invent complexity for them for whatever reason. So in my eyes fanfiction can certainly be used to make a character more complex than they necessarily are, simply by exploring them and by putting certain images of them in people's head

[halfshellvenus]

Maybe his status as a sidekick on the show carried over too heavily into fanfic and people perceive him as a character who works only as supporting rather than as lead.

I was going to go with this one. He's a sidekick on the show, and he's sweet and loveable but not interestingly dark or complex (like T-Bag, Mahone, or Kellerman).

One could say similar things about LJ-- if it weren't for the teen writers, about 50% of the little LJ fic that exists wouldn't have been written. He's just not a terribly interesting character.

And this is coming from a person who wrote a Maricruz story (!), in part because we kind of hate her choosing Hector over Sucre. And the obligatory Sucre/Michael friendship story of course.

But if you never read it before, one of the past rounds of the PB Fic Exchange has a great story with ALL the cousins in Sucre's family. It feels surprisingly rich, given that we know very little about any of those characters. Written by callmetofu. :)

[thelana]

Personally, I think LJ, if LJ was around more, has potential to have a certain little black dress appeal, especially in slash. You know, the kind of thing where the bottom has to be short and emotional and fair haired. In the slash dominance ranking LJ is probably dead last and in that line of thinking the perfect bottom. Which is probably why there was a time where he got slashed with people he'd never even had a scene with (Abruzzi, T-Bag, Sucre).

Not to mention that at the moment LJ is strongly tied to Michael and Lincoln and it would probably hard to write a happily ever after story for either of them where he wasn't mentioned. So I think LJ kind of has a shoe-in position in fanfiction.

Even if LJ is not a terribly interesting character in himself at the moment, writing about what he means to Lincoln or LJ probably guarantees him some face time (even though it isn't really about HIM being explored as a character).

[halfshellvenus]

You know, the kind of thing where the bottom has to be short and emotional and fair haired.
But Michael is a much more attractive bottom, and has the advantage of not being underaged. I'll never get over that particular issue with LJ. Plus, I don't find him attractive at all.

Most of the people who write him are in the 14-24 age range, so underage isn't an issue at all for them!

writing about what he means to Lincoln or LJ probably guarantees him some face time (even though it isn't really about HIM being explored as a character).
Which by contrast shows one of the areas Sucre suffers, which several people already mentioned and I forgot to add: his main relationship is with Michael, and that makes him even MORE of a sidekick somehow. :0

[thelana]

But Michael is a much more attractive bottom, and has the advantage of not being underaged.

See, I disagree. For starters, Michael is tall. Other than Abruzzi I don't think that there are that many people who are taller than him and he is very visibly taller than Sucre, Whistler and T-Bag for starters. He also has gotten a lot more muscular since season 1, by now we know that he can fight back (the first duel in Sona for example). He has also shown himself to be quite cold, judgemental and unforgiving around his enemies, like T-Bag or Kellerman.

Again, that doesn't mean that he is a bad submissive partner, but in the stereotypical yaoi type of thinking he doesn't really fit all that well anymore (at least not with all partners). LJ is a lot more stereotypical when it comes to girly bottom characteristics.

Which by contrast shows one of the areas Sucre suffers, which several people already mentioned and I forgot to add: his main relationship is with Michael, and that makes him even MORE of a sidekick somehow. :0Yeah, I agree. I

[recycledfaery]

For me it is because he is such an uncomplicated guy. Everyone basically likes him and his character is pretty straight forward.

Whereas Michael, Sara, Lincoln to name a few are very complex. When I watch PB I feel as if the writers only touch on these characters. Obviously it is due to the format of TV, but I find myself thinking about what lies behind their words and actions. And then I want to write or read about it further.

With Sucre I don't get those questions. To me it's like what you see is what you get. And I don;t really have questions about him. Therefore no need to explore further.

So that's my short answer.

[thelana]

Interesting thought. And I have to say, I don't disagree one bit. After all, I don't exactly run around scouring the net for Sucre fiction. It's just that sometimes I have the nagging feeling like I should care more and just don't. :(

[recycledfaery]

I have the nagging feeling like I should care more and just don't. :(
LOL I get that feeling too.

[niektete]

I can't help myself - he seems so one-dimensional. Then on the other hand, so does Lincoln (to me). In short, I use them for porn (guilty), but I can't draw inspiration for them for serious stuff. Sad, but true.

[thelana]

With Lincoln, I think it kinda depends on whether or not you have sympathy for his situation. Like, I can see how he is probably pretty boring compared to colorful characters like T-Bag or Abruzzi or even Kellerman. So my guess he mostly works if you look at him as a guy you like or a guy in whose position you can see yourself in. Like, "What would I do if I was trying to protect my son/trying to keep my family together/had inspired my brother to go fucking nuts for me/was indirectly the cause of the death of so many people".

[niektete]

I am completely honest when I say that I admire writers who can think Lincoln like that. I am also completely ashamed when I admit that the sight of his unbuttoned shirts kind of add him straight to my porn list *blushes* But like you say, it's a matter of perspective - if compared to T-Bag, he is kind of boring, but then again, I think he's one of the most normal and natural characters on the show, next to Sucre. Perhaps that just doesn't appeal to writers? Normal, ordinary guys?

[thelana]

Only that compared to Sucre he seems to get more play in fanfiction (and a decent number of people do seem to consider him a complex character). Of course, he also gets more screentime than Sucre and has significant relationships with a wider variety of characters.

I think he's one of the most normal and natural characters on the show, next to Sucre.

I do think that the he was probably kinda designed that way, even more so than Michael. That he is the every-man, the one, when in doubt, we should identify with. Whether that is successful is a different question.

Of course, on the other side he also has this canonical past with drugs and jail time, so if people *want* they can invent this whole crazy drug and whoring past for him.