Something I noticed: (U.S.-centric fashion)

[dysgr8mystake]

Many of you here have read Susan Faludi's book Backlash: The Undeclared War Against American Women. For those of who you haven't, it's a book originally published in 1991. It details some of the aspects of the 'backlash culture'; the way every time American feminism (and feminist movements in other countries as well) make a few steps forward,

Comments

[smallraven]

This is really interesting to me, and makes a lot of sense. However, I will confess, as a fashionista, i really love the whole gothic victorian look, it's my favorite part of fall fashion that has been reaccoccuring for at least the last ten years. However, in my day life, when I was corporate, I usually wore black pants and a polo shirt, as did the other girlies my age there. When I was getting annoyed with corporate culture, I decided to wear more of a fifties housewife style to be ironic (I wore it with big black combat boots and sparkly laces so I think the message was heard).

[dysgr8mystake]

I have nothing against the victorian look except for when it's applied to "corporate" work situations, because often, dressing in ruffles and frills like a victorian child's doll isn't the way to get taken seriously. It's not only because it's women wearing these looks; if a man came into a business room dressed like a 16th century man (with the ruffled things and tights and such), would he get taken seriously?

This, I don't believe, has a gender thing so much as serious situations demand usually serious clothing.

Bah. That may have come out wrong.

I walk into serious "corporate" environments (for interviews, etc) in a suit. I generally wear it in neutral colors and such, but it's a suit. I like suits.

[dancing_moon]

Heh. If you go into H&M (big swedish cheapo-fashion chain) you will see more ruffles and lace than you'd think belong in this century. The catwalks in France are filled with neo-victorian. Luxury, feminity (and paleness, worth to note) are 'in'.
There's also something I think they call boho-chic and ethnic fashions (how I loath that term), but it's even more expensive and covering than before

In Japan, the street trend went a couple of years ago to the "gothic lolita" fashion, a little-girl doll look with dark aspects (sometimes). It seems this trend has begun to die down, but japanese street fashion is often touted as being far ahead

I like it - but I've liked goth for many years now. I also see this as party and dress up clothes, not something for everyday wear

It's interesting to see how fashion and history matches; if one looks at economy, there is also a clear tie between skirt lenghts and the amount of money around.

[dysgr8mystake]

It's interesting to see how fashion and history matches; if one looks at economy, there is also a clear tie between skirt lenghts and the amount of money around.

Exactly

[timetoknowbe]

i *love* the lolita fashions. i never liked the gothic versions though. i think what i liked was considered "country lolita" or something. pastel colors; more of a real "baby doll" victorian look than gothic.

and on a completely unrelated note, its nice to hear paleness is a good thing somewhere.

[sarsalot]

Personally, I see encouraging paleness as a good thing. Here (in Australia) something like 2/3 people will develop a form of skin cancer at some point in their lives, and part of reason this is so prevalent is that 'tanned' is fashionable.
I realise that you mentioned that from the perspective of racism, but in my view encouraging tanning is another example of the fashion industry pushing unhealthy standards on women.

[delphyne_]

Fashion has never done women any favours apart from maybe a brief period in the seventies and eighties when comfortable items like flat shoes and boiler suits were fashionable.

It's a con trick to get women to spend all our time focusing on our looks rather than our lives and also ensures, by keeping us in "feminine" clothing, that men can feel suitably different and superior to us.

[dysgr8mystake]

I like clothing,t hough; I like its decorate uses and I like, occasionally, "dressing up" (I don't wear skirts, so this mostly means piling on fun stuff like embroidered jeans and lots of jewelry) just for the fun aspect of it. It doesn't honestly run my life and I don't respond well to "fashion dictates" like the ones going on now in the magazines.

It does seem, however, that stuff like this shows up whenever women are considered a "threat".

[delphyne_]

Well that's lucky for you that you don't feel dictated to by fashion, a lot of women do however. When I was a teenager, me and my friends were certainly very concerned about being "fashionable". Given the fact that fashion is a multi-billion dollar industry with it's propaganda all over the media it's pretty clear that many women have the same problem.

My favourite fashion fact is that the word "fashion" has the same roots as "fascist".

[dysgr8mystake]

Hey, watch the condescension there.

I don't think the answer is to eliminate all of that stuff, though. For one, it's not going to work. Maybe the better idea is to start a kind of... er... (thinking real hard for 8 AM, bear with me) campaign, as it were, for individuality. People will always want to decorate themselves. That's a big part of the reason for fashion being so big; its decorative uses. just have to get people to a point where they stop "marking their tribe" through up-to-the-moment fashion and instead buy things that honestly flatter them (and generally, buying something you really actually truly like does).

[crafting_change]

Most men expect us to look feminine
and I just love fulfilling those expectations!

I think the parallel of now, and 1980s is becoming more and more apparent every day.

[dysgr8mystake]

It really is. It's kind of frightening, honestly.

[lovefromgirl]

I see where you're coming from, definitely. Now that you mention it, I see the parallel between now and the post-WWII period, fashion-wise: a return to ultra-femmy styles, although personally I prefer now to then (having always been fond of Victorian fashion!).

Although fashion happens to coincide with my tastes, I still think it's backwards that all women are being exhorted to wear these ultra-frilly things. Some people just want to be practical, comfortable, or -- gasp! -- not traditionally feminine. To each hir own, yes?

Take heart: sometime in the next five to ten years, we should see a return to more unisex designs. After the Victorians, there came the Jazz Age; after the Fifties, the Sixties. Neither decade was perfect, but it wasn't as excruciating as the one before it.

[dancing_moon]

Some people just want to be practical, comfortable, or -- gasp! -- not traditionally feminine. To each hir own, yes?

Definitely. One of the most annoying thing with the fashion industry is that there's usually only one style of clothing out in the stores. I hate pastels (on myself) fiercely, so there have been months when I buy nothing but socks even though I need new clothes. But it's all fugly colors or models.

And let's not even mention shoes...

[lovefromgirl]

Oh, gods no. Shoes I cannot find, not anywhere. Effing sizeist shoe manufacturers call 5 a women's size but don't make many shoes that small, so...

[dysgr8mystake]

I'm waiting. I can't wait for the new Jazz Age. ^^