Comments | fatpie42: Ayaan Hirsi Ali's Book

fatpie42

Ayaan Hirsi Ali's Book - FAIL!

May 09, 2010 17:02

Extracts are available here.

Just read the extract on terrorism:
"A larger group of Muslims, most of them in Europe and America, believes that acts of terror committed by fellow Muslims will unleash a western backlash against all Muslims indiscriminately. "
Um... they think this because it is the truth. It's not something they fear in the future ( Read more... )

ayaan hirsi ali, islamophobia

Comments 27

a_tergo_lupi May 9 2010, 16:20:32 UTC

I agree.

Book Review a_tergo_lupi May 10 2010, 03:32:31 UTC

Although it is from last year, I think you may find this book review useful. The author comes from a Muslim perspective and reviews her works. The link is here ... it is good to hear other opinions and ideas.

http://loga-abdullah.blogspot.com/2008/11/defending-our-diin-ayaan-hirsi-ali.html

Hope you find it interesting.

Re: Book Review fatpie42 May 10 2010, 07:02:52 UTC

Thank you. I have as yet to read it in depth, but I've skimmed over it and it does look very interesting.

Re: Book Review a_tergo_lupi May 10 2010, 13:22:35 UTC

I found it interesting, but rather cursory, and sometimes wrong.

Ali is very clear at the start of the book that her grandmother had many animist beliefs blended into her Islam. But, either Islam is or isn't practiced by people, just as Christianity is or isn't practiced by people. The people in that faith matter, and how they believe matters. I understand that Orthodoxy is important in understanding a faith as "intended," but faith is a living thing as well.

I also found it interesting that the author specifically failed to address the claims about Muhammad, choosing instead to decide they were too horrible to be addressed. How convenient.

vonheston May 9 2010, 18:17:30 UTC

I respect Ayaan Hirsi Ali as a memoir-ist. I've only read part of her memoir, but it seems like her experiences were horrible and it is good that she was able to give a voice to women who have or will suffer similar experiences and get the word out ( ... )

a_tergo_lupi May 9 2010, 19:51:19 UTC

Her assessment of why minorities tend to live in ghettos is rather simplified. There is probably something to the whole persecution thing, but i'm sure that is only part of it. People all over the world naturally want to live around people with the same cultural values as themselves - There are still tons of ethnic ghettos in my home city of Philadelphia. (Italian, Polish, Irish, etc)

Well, the problem is, she doesn't think they're actually persecuted.

"With this collective feeling of being persecuted, many Muslim families living in the west insulate themselves in ghettoes."

And, they do, both for the feelings they have relating to misperceived religious whatever, but also because of very real racial and ethnic issues. I had a conversation with a professor at the intensive French program I went to and, in his experience, your name will win or lose a job in France. It's like that here, to some extent, but at least we have pretenses. He didn't seem to think they did.

fatpie42 May 9 2010, 20:44:16 UTC

And of course, in areas where there aren't social issues keeping people apart, Muslims are quite happy to get involved in the wider community. In the comedy "Goodness Gracious Me" one of the regular themes of the jokes is how young asians (whether Indian or Pakistani, whether Muslim, Hindu or Sikh) are strongly encouraged to do well at school and to become lawyers or doctors. Those aren't the sort of jobs that people living in "ghettos" tend to perform...

a_tergo_lupi May 9 2010, 21:51:07 UTC

The use of the word "ghetto" is confusing to people who think the term originates with an enforced encampment.

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fatpie42 May 10 2010, 06:43:56 UTC

depending upon the country

I believe her experience (as an MP) relates to Holland....

cyranothe2nd May 10 2010, 03:20:44 UTC

I don't see the bad from the extracts you've quoted ( ... )

fatpie42 May 10 2010, 06:51:23 UTC

the idea of immigrants who are isolated or isolate themselves isn't confined to Muslims--it's typical of many immigrant groups

That's a problem with what she wrote. She is saying it's a particular reason to be concerned about Islam.

I'm not sure I agree with "insulate themselves" rather than "are insulated" but I'd have to reserve judgment until I've read the book.

I think just reading the extracts found in the link in the OP would be enough to show that this isn't just an unfortunate use of words, but part of the general trend of her writing.

Also, how exactly is "significantly higher birthrate" out of context? What has the "birthrate" got to do with anything?

cyranothe2nd May 10 2010, 07:01:20 UTC

No, I think if you read the quote again, she's saying that the trend of isolation, high birthrate and continued immigration will make the unhappy, dysfunctional youths that result easy prey for radical Islamic groups. Which, isn't a particularly inflammatory statement, imo.

fatpie42 May 10 2010, 07:12:53 UTC

Fair point. Though it still upsets me that her solution seems to be to cut immigration rather than helping to make sure Muslims (and immigrants as a whole for that matter) are less isolated.

Perhaps to put in context why I'm in such a bad mood over this, I found the link to the extracts here:
http://community.livejournal.com/ontd_political/6143147.html

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