Links to material

[missyjack]

I am an admin at the Supernatural Wiki, which is a wiki site for the TV show Supernatural that covers both the show and the fandom. For each fan convention we have an entry where fans link to their reports, pictures and videos taken during the Conventions. Many conventions have prohibitions on videotaping, but it happens anyway and is usually

Comments

[shiv5468]

Never mind the legals... being a fan isn't something that you necessarily want out on the internet. You go to a con with a non taping policy because you don't expect your hobby to get out on the internet with possible consequences for you job / career / marriage / friends / family.

And then some bright spark breaks those rules and puts it up on the internet anyway. If I were in those videos, I'd be livid. My expectation of privacy has been breached.

[fools_game]

To clarify, the video in question were of the celebrity guests, not the fans.

The convention, on the other hand, will be releasing a video of the convention weekend which will include footage of the fans, and at no piont did they ask for permission to film those fans.

[shiv5468]

Who also have an expectation that their image will not be used without permission.

[janinelearner]

The Hub Productions website has a terms and conditions page that states:

11. By attending a Hub event, you waive any personal or property rights for your likeness appearing in either still photographs or DVD recordings used by DCA Enterprises for either promotional purposes, or event DVD release.

from http://www.thehubproductions.com/terms-and-conditions

To add, there is a section there about videoing which states that anyone caught filming may be removed from the event, but there is nothing that states that anything will be done after the event if it is found that someone had done it while there.

[koulagirl666]

I'm assuming that people are adding their reports themselves, here

[missyjack]

They told the fan concerned they would go to YouTube if she didn't take the content down, and I would imagine they would have a valid copyright claim.

So the question of the links is now moot. But i am still interested whether linking to material equates with posting the material.

[koulagirl666]

I'm not sure they do have a valid copyright claim, but that's a whole other story.

Linking doesn't always equate to publishing, but it can. If you have control over the links and you're presenting them in a context, it is more likely to be found that way, but just a list of links that you aggregate but don't post might not. It hasn't really been looked at here in a copyright setting, and I imagine the bar would be different than for defamation.

[missyjack]

Thanks. I mean we don't post links to things like episode or music downloads, or anything like that on the Wiki. We're even more circumspect with posting images from episodes than most fan sites. And for around 30 Conventions, no other Con has done this.

[in_the_bottle]

One of the reasons they were requesting for no video recording at the con was because some of the guest's contract specified no video recording or something along those lines.

Though I'm a bit surprised that the organisers are now actually policing the internet for convention content! I think that's a bit beyond the call of duty for them! And I'm not quite sure contacting you was the best way of going about it since like someone else mentioned, you aren't hosting the content. They should've contacted the people who uploaded the clips or the server hosting it, ie. YouTube.

[missyjack]

I understand the contractual obligations to guests. Fact is it exists at all Cons, most of whom restrict taping in some way. However, and this is after covering about 20 Cons, no others have ever policed fan videos after the event. Let alone the Wiki, and our site has even been linked by media outlets.

[calliopeia17]

You realize, right, that just because every other Con has chosen not to enforce their video policies, it doesn't mean that this Con can't? The actions of third parties have no legal effect on them

[rubymiene]

If the con itself is taping, then I don't think there is a privacy issue. The con wants to make money by selling video, and thinks that these videos cut into its profits.

The bad side to taking down the links is two-fold:
1. It's censorship based on a threat of extremely dubious legal action. I don't like the law being abused in this way. I don't think they have any claim against you at all. They might have a contract claim against the original posters, but they'd have difficulty proving damages. They could have a copyright-like claim against the original posters if Australia has something akin to the Anti-bootlegging statute that doesn't only specify musical performances (any Aussie lawyers out there know the answer?), and you didn't post, you only linked. I don't know why people brought up defamation, as there's no claim of falsity. I also assume that you and your server are in the US, so they'd have a hell of a time with jurisdiction. Of course, the reason this kind of bullying works is because most people, and most fans

[mrslant]

I suggest you reply to them asking them to state the precise legal basis on which they claim to be entitled to require you to remove these links. If you ever hear back from them, take advice on what they say.

[missyjack]

I imagine if i tried to fight to fight it they may not peruse it, but i would need balance risking the Wiki over this one incident.

[johnnypenn]

I say they were just trying to scare you because they had an agenda and they didn't like that stuffhad leaked.
After all, if you go to a con, you expect to be photographed and video taped. And those things go on YouTube because people want to share their experiences with fans who couldn't go.

And. The actors on the panel know that by going to a con, they're gonna be asked for photographs, interviews, autographs. It's part and parcel of promoting their show. I think someone was just trying to make some extra dough, hence why they wanted those links down. They can't sell their video when you've got fan vids up for free, right?