Comments | dwrewatch: Doctor Who, Or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love School Reunion/Girl in the Fireplace

surrexi in dwrewatch

Doctor Who, Or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love School Reunion/Girl in the Fireplace

Jan 30, 2008 21:19

(Warning! Extreme Verbosity Ahead! Proceed With Caution!)

I'm going to perhaps not strictly follow the rules (they're more like guidelines, anyway?) because I want to briefly touch on Tooth & Claw and then I can't really address the things I want to address about School Reunion and Girl in the Fireplace without taking them together.

First, ( a couple things about Tooth & Claw. )

2x03 school reunion, 2x02 tooth and claw, 2x04 the girl in the fireplace

Comments 22

goldy_dollar January 31 2008, 05:54:53 UTC

Wow. This is an incredible piece of analysis. I particularly like how you've managed to tie everything together and FIT it into the overall S2 arc. The early season 2 continuity sometimes drives me NUTS.

TOTALLY agree on where you're coming from on SR. Especially this:

It's like throwing cold water over Rose's head - puts quite a damper on the whole frolicking through space and time thing when suddenly you're worried you might get dropped off in Aberdeen and left behind if the Doctor sees something shinier than you.

And this:

The Doctor is telling Rose that yes, he loves her. He feels for her what she feels for him, but he's got to angst about it a bit more than she does because, as he continues, she can spend the rest of her life with him (and it's telling in and of itself that he says she can, all things considered), but he can't with her, because she'll die on him (all my theories on Rose being as immortal as Jack aside *cough*). Poor Rose is now also forced to face up to the idea that as much fun as they're having now, someday ( ... )

surrexi February 1 2008, 00:06:01 UTC

that moment between them outside the chip shop really is HUGE.

Exactly! That is THE MOMENT when the Doctor finally acknowledges that they ARE in a relationship, that there is something more going on between them than just being best friends, even if they (almost) never allow themselves to discuss it.

While I can see where you're coming from on GitF being OOC, I don't see it as strongly as you do. I do think that the Doctor (a) does have a tendency to get distracted by shiny things/people and by his own whims/passing-fancies-that-don't-pass-but-stop and (b) trusted Rose enough to hold down the fort (so to speak) on the spaceship whilst he investigated in France. But mostly he was distracted by the shiny, and while it is not his best trait, I do think it is part of who he is, though thankfully he usually manages to keep it more controlled ( ... )

selenityshiroi January 31 2008, 06:33:54 UTC

I think that the Doctor's reaction at the end is not only to do with how short human lives are but also his effect on said lives ( ... )

surrexi February 1 2008, 00:11:52 UTC

I think that the Doctor's reaction at the end is not only to do with how short human lives are but also his effect on said lives.

Oh yes, definetely. I think he absolutely feels guilty at the idea that if he and Rose were to be separated by something other than her death, it could/would give her a lot of emotional problems (I like to pretend Doomsday didn't happen when I think about SR/GitF because they so perfectly foreshadow what the Doctor's going to go through/be like post-Rose, *sniffles*).

But, I just can't suspend my disbelief long enough to convince myself that Ten loved Reinette. Crush and hero worship, yes. Love? Don't believe it.

Absolutely see your point there, and I'm definetely using the term "fall for" loosely when I say he falls for Reinette. But he was definetely caught up in a whirlwind of emotion over her, and that's why I think GitF serves such an important purpose in terms of illustrating what happens to the Doctor because of his relationship with Rose, whereas in SR Sarah Jane served that purpose with ( ... )

javabreeze January 31 2008, 06:34:24 UTC

principia January 31 2008, 18:22:00 UTC

If we can't have JD as Eleven, I'd want to see him as Fitz if/when they ever get around to a multiera story featuring Eight.

surrexi February 1 2008, 00:14:31 UTC

Well, I can see you have good taste because I am also rooting for Jack Davenport as Eleven. ;)

He would be perfect, as far as I'm concerned. And hey, if Steven Moffatt takes over RTD's job when RTD leaves, then he'll have already worked with Jack on Coupling!

I think your analysis of School Reunion is on point. I have a few of my own issues with The Girl In the Fireplace but I did enjoy reading your take.

Thanks :) GitF will never be my favorite episode, and like I said, I used to have a lot more issues with it than I do now. So I totally get where you're coming from... and I'm glad you enjoyed my ramblings!

principia February 1 2008, 16:37:32 UTC

Unless production moves to London (which I don't think is feasible given the budget), SM has pretty much said he's not interested in taking the job, 'cos he's not moving his children to Cardiff and he will not spend 9 months out of the year away from them.

Kinda like how John Simm is currently picking his roles.

unbrokensky January 31 2008, 08:17:32 UTC

YES. YES YES YES. You have such skill about articulating these things... but that's exactly why I like GitF. And your points about the "honeymoon period" are SO TRUE, LOL. I'd never thought of it like that, but, SO SO TRUE. HEEE.

surrexi February 1 2008, 00:17:57 UTC

HEE. I only managed to get it articulated this well because I've been letting the whole meta percolate in my head for a good month and a half now, lol.

Yeah, GitF will never be a favorite of mine, but I feel like I've definetely made my peace with it, lol.

I love the honeymoon period. I could watch New Earth/Tooth & Claw OVER AND OVER and I would never get tired of them, I swear, lol.

unbrokensky February 1 2008, 02:57:09 UTC

I could watch New Earth/Tooth & Claw OVER AND OVER and I would never get tired of them, I swear, lol.

You and me both. XD

skybound2 January 31 2008, 18:14:47 UTC

What I realised, once I went into the episode looking at it through the lens of "What Awesome Thing is Steven Moffatt trying to tell me with this story" is that Ten/Reinette is essentially a super-fast-forwarded version of Doctor/Rose.

This is EXACTLY how I see this episode. I've been flittering back and forth with it lately, and I think you hit the nail on the head wit that statement.

I also whole-heartedly agree with your assessment that GitF is to the Doctor what SR was to Rose. This makes so much sense, and really helps to fit both episodes into the overall Character arcs.

He's a Time Lord, and Time Lords preserve timelines. He's the Doctor, and the Doctor saves people. Rose knows that. The Doctor knows that she knows that. I don't think it's a decision he made lightly, but in the end he chose what he had to choose.Yes! A lot of people get down on him for going through that mirror, but he really had very little choice, because as Rose pointed out to Reinette earlier, NONE of this was supposed to happen. And the Doctor needed ( ... )

surrexi February 1 2008, 00:21:45 UTC

Thank you!

A lot of people get down on him for going through that mirror, but he really had very little choice, because as Rose pointed out to Reinette earlier, NONE of this was supposed to happen. And the Doctor needed to stop it before it went to far.

Exactly. There was really no other choice the Doctor could have made, and I don't think Rose would ever have stopped him from making it. It's definetely entirely possibly and highly probable that they did have at least a short conversation prior to his rescue, because I do think it's unlikely he'd have done that without at least saying goodbye.