Seriously help needed for a reactive barker.

[icelore]

My younger dog is a reactive barker. I've been working on the problem with him, but he's got some serious issues that I've not been able to resolve. I've spoken to both my vet and behaviorists and am not closer to a solution

Comments

[threegoldfish]

Honestly to me he sounds like a prime candidate for anxiety meds. Were this a friend of mine I'd asking them if they had talked to a doctor about Xanax or something. This doesn't sound like something you can purely train him out of, given that he's generally well trained already and sounds like he wants to do what you ask but is physically unable to.

You might also be interested on this post on OTC anxiety supplements http://teamunruly.com/?p=3614

[icelore]

He probably is a candidate for them, but since I still haven't tried everything, I was asking for people's opinions on the vet's suggestion. I may not be able to train him out of it, but since Shelties are slow to mature, he still has time to learn emotional inhibition. I want to give him that chance before turning to medication.

But this post wasn't really about why or why not and at what time I will try meds, just looking for advice or suggestions on anything I might have missed! I will definitely look into OTC options, ty much. :D

[recreatexme]

Why are you exhausting all options before using medications? In my experience, more people should be open to using both natural supplements and/or medication as a first defense while you are working on the issues at hand if they are extreme enough (this sounds like it is). It will hopefully allow him to relax enough to focus on actual behavior modification and you might find something you've tried before, like classic counter conditioning, "suddenly" starts to work once he has been medicated for awhile. I waited 3 years to put my anxious and fearful dog on fluoxetine and my only regret is that I waited that long. He improved in leaps and bounds after we had hit a wall with regards to his training; something they really do need that extra help.

It does not sound like a collar would help much in this situation, he will likely just bark right through it and it might even heighten the anxiety.

[icelore]

I view medications as a step to be taken after all other ideas have been tried. Maybe other people go to pills first, but that's not me. Clearly I haven't tried everything since my vet still had other suggestions, which is why I was asking for opinions on that, not weather I should put him on anxiety meds or not. I'm sorry I wasn't clear on that.

[recreatexme]

I really hope you reconsider at some point.

[icelore]

Reconsider what? Putting him on meds? Clearly I'm already considering it, since I said that is what I would do if nothing else worked out. No where did I say that I would never use them or anything like that.

[emekitty]

I agree with the other commenters -- why so reluctant about medication?

Your dog sounds like the ideal candidate. It also sounds like you have already exhausted other options. I would talk to the vet and start him on a Rx. Good luck!

[icelore]

I'm not reluctant, but I view medications as a step to be taken after all other ideas have been tried. Maybe other people go to pills first, but that's not me. Clearly I haven't tried everything since my vet still had other suggestions, which is why I was asking for opinions on that, not weather I should put him on anxiety meds or not. I'm sorry I wasn't clear on that.

[emekitty]

I understand what you are saying, and I get this kind of feeling, but at some point, I think you need to put aside your personal feelings and do what is best for your dog. Your dog does not sound as if he is really having the best time here, you know what I mean? I can't imagine your dog is happy feeling like he is panicked & out-of-control

[icelore]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion of medicine for metal issues, but as I pointed out, that wasn't the point of my post. As someone who has severe anxiety, I think I have a pretty good grasp on how medication as well as mental issues have been demonized by society. Comparing anxiety to diabetes isn't even in the same field, and even then, when you have diabetes, assuming you have regular doctor care, they don't just shoot you up with insulin anyway. They try diet and exercise first, then hopefully it can be managed with pills. Only if absolutely necessary is injectable insulin the go-to choice when there are other options. I'm just looking to explore those options. His health and well being is worth few months of our time seeing if anything will work for him before we start bunny-hopping trying to find the right meds.

[blitzkriegx]

This. Exactly what recreatexme says. My whippet x american eskimo is an extreme fear barker (and biter!) and I am just about to embark on adding some natural remedies and medication to his regimen. Dennis does not sound as severe as Inde, but very similar in triggers and 'losing his mind' when he starts. I have a dog-aggressive border collie as well and she has shown significant improvement since being on rescue remedy and a few other 'herbal' calming agents. A thundershirt seems to help soothe Dennis a little bit - have you tried this yet?

[icelore]

I haven't tried a thundershirt because I don't know when the stimulus is going to be happening. :( I have tried body pressure if I know my bf is due home for example, and that does make a difference to some degree, so a thundershirt might work for anxiety separation conditioning. Going out in the hall, coming back in, etc. I didn't think of that, ty!

Thankfully Inde isn't fear aggressive, not even to the point where he would break if pushed, but it hurts my heart to have him fearful. :( My older dog is 100% convinced that anyone who comes to the hose is there solely to see and pet him, but Inde is skittish like a cat and circles at a distance. I feel like a bad owner for not socializing him enough or something, but I know he got enough exposure that he shouldn't be like this. I'm reading up on Rescue Remedy now, as it was the most popular option in my searches, it looks like something I will try. Any other suggestions for herbals that I should look into?

[liannas_mom]

Are you sure it's reactive, and he isn't just a highly vocal dog? I only say that as a long time collie owner, and collies and shelties are two of the noisiest breeds I have ever worked with. They talk, all the time, they were breed to herd with their voices. And they talk loud and persistent

[icelore]

No matter how vocal a dog is, they can be trained to stop vocalizing after an appropriate time. If they cannot, either there is something wrong witht eh train methods, or something wrong with the dog. He's a dog and will bark, but to persist after being told to stop is not an ok behavior.

He's very active and engaged. We keep his energy run off. :) Both boys (both are Shelties) are very well mannered and content and have their exercise and mental stimulation needs met.

I wouldn't consider getting him debarked. If a dog is barking at that level, there is something that needs to be addressed, not just muted so I don't have to deal with it. :/