Kilts?

[cirith_ungol]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that a true kilt had to be made out of a tartan fabric. At the very least, plaid.

Unless I'm wrong in that assumption, Roddy Piper just came out on TV wearing an ordinary pleated skirt.

Comments

[dglenn]

I think there may be multiple, competing, valid definitions of "true kilt" in this context. There are American kilts that are definitely menswear, and IMNSHO definitely 'kilts', but which make no attempt at all to be Scottish kilts (though I see them quite a bit these days at Scottish festivals and more general Celtic festivals in the US). The brands I know are Utilikilt and Amerikilt. The ones I've seen have been solids or camoflauge paterns, not tartans.

Irish kilts are also, at least sometimes (I need to go read up) solid colours -- the ones I've seen that I was able to identify as Irish have all been solids; as I understand it they're significantly more modern than Scottish kilts but much older than American ones.

As for whether a 'true' Scottish kilt has to be in a tartan, I'll leave that to historical costumers who know better than I when tartans arose and when specific tartans began to be associated with specific clans. I do seem to recall that for a considerable chunk of time the distinctive feature of Scottish dress was

[cirith_ungol]

Considering the fact that his 'ring music' is bagpipes, I'm assuming he's going for the Scottish look. He normally wears a red plaid with a bit of yellow, which may or may not be a real tartan, but this was a simple black pleated number, not even going for the great-kilt 'over-the-shoulder' look.

[baronessekat]

the tartan signifies what clan you belong to. Each clan has a registered tartan.

If you want to get technical only members of a clan can were a certain tartan.

It has fallen by the wayside in modern times but I know of some Scots that do take offense to a non-clan member wearing their clan's colors.

A kilt is a utilitarian garment and was a fairly easy way to display one's colors to the world.

I do not belief that in modern times a kilt has to be strictly of tartan. From the sounds of it, he was wearing a modern lesser kilt, which does look remarkably like a plain old pleated skirt.

[dglenn]

"the tartan signifies what clan you belong to. Each clan has a registered tartan."

a) Also, some cities and counties have their own tartans as well! I'm not certain exactly what constitutes "legitimately" wearing a geographical tartan.

b) From what I've read, the tartan<->clan linkage is modern (so presumably relevant to a WWF context, but probably not to the SCA).

"It has fallen by the wayside in modern times but I know of some Scots that do take offense to a non-clan member wearing their clan's colors."

*nod* I've talked to more people who don't care, or don't care much, but there are enough who take it seriously that I'm inclined to play it safe to avoid giving offense. I wear Black Watch on stage because I didn't know what the MacArthur tartan looked like when I bought my kilt and even though I shouldn't technically wear Black Watch, it seemed the safest choice (anyone who considered it inappropriate at least wouldn't take it personally). I've since gotten some MacArthur fabric but I haven't gotten it made into a kilt yet

[cirith_ungol]

From the casual research I've done, the geographical kilts seem to be prevalent in Ireland. Not sure what constitutes a 'legitimate' claim on that.

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if MacAthair used the same tartan as MacArthur, since it sounds like the family name is a derivation. Unfortunately, my list of clan affiliations and tartans is hiding in the 'boxes to be unpacked'.

[dglenn]

Actually, MacAthair and MacArthur aren't connected (and despite the spelling misdirection, aren't pronounced similarly) -- MacAthair translates (I'm told) to "son of a father", and to be eligible for membership in the clan, you must have, or at some point in your life have had, a father. (I want to get one of the baseball caps that says "[your name] By Birth, MacAthair By Choice".) There are a bunch of homebrewers in the clan, and the official clan beer "MacAthair-Of-The-Dog", a Scotch ale (and a clue as to how the name of the clan is pronounced) is awfully darned tasty! (It's kind of like Skull Splitter ale

[pooka798]

Kilts are a fashion unto themseleves lately. There's UtiliKilts and Sport Kilts (with velcro). Kilts aren't just 5 yards of itchy plaid wool anymore.