That's what Angel's trying to escape in Reprise. That's what Buffy thinks her friends can't handle in Once More, With Feeling. Both of them take comfort in sex with a vampire
( Read more... )
Not sure I'd call Sam Vimes nice (or Nice). I agree he's somewhere in the middle between Carrot and the Patrician, but I struggle to find another word to define the position.
However, back to the Jossverse: I'd say that Giles is Right most of the time - putting the Greater Good above all (most pointedly in his arguments with Buffy in The Gift and Lies.... So is Wesley. Both men, however, relate to individuals and have at times put individual affection over the greater good, though rarely. Angel in season 2 and apparently now again (interesting that season 2's malaise was after losing (human) Darla, and season 5 after losing Connor) is trying to be Right and Good without being Nice, but has trouble managing even the Right part. Buffy I think stopped being Good in the idealising Carrot sense as early as season 2. She always tried for Right. (Not saying she always suceeded, obviously.) Nice becomes an increasing effort in times of extreme stress, but it should be noted that even an emotionally exhausted Buffy (like in Anne, or Empty
( ... )
I'm unsure of it myself sometimes, but when asked to find a character who was Nice, Vimes is who Terry Pratchett named.
Maybe, not so much as Nice, what he is is personal. Both Carrot and Vetinari do deal at people from a distance ("Personal isn't the same as important." - Carrot), whereas Vimes always deals with people, not ideals. Carrot can force people to do the Good thing through sheer force of will, and Vetinari can force people to do the Right thing by dint of the fact that he's the Partician. Perhaps the key to Nice is that you don't try to make people change. You accept them as they are, whatever that may be, not forcing your own views on them
( ... )
I always thought Willow in S4-6 was a portrayal of the dangers of thinking that Nice was enough. She certainly reminded me of Lily Weatherwax up to the point where the drug metaphor kicked in.
Hmm. That's an interesting thought. And she, like Lily, could annoy me so much. And I could see her pulling just that type of thing, actually. The screwed up fairy-tale land.
And it's possible that my 'not really a Willow fan at all' roots are showing.
Comments 4
However, back to the Jossverse: I'd say that Giles is Right most of the time - putting the Greater Good above all (most pointedly in his arguments with Buffy in The Gift and Lies.... So is Wesley. Both men, however, relate to individuals and have at times put individual affection over the greater good, though rarely. Angel in season 2 and apparently now again (interesting that season 2's malaise was after losing (human) Darla, and season 5 after losing Connor) is trying to be Right and Good without being Nice, but has trouble managing even the Right part. Buffy I think stopped being Good in the idealising Carrot sense as early as season 2. She always tried for Right. (Not saying she always suceeded, obviously.) Nice becomes an increasing effort in times of extreme stress, but it should be noted that even an emotionally exhausted Buffy (like in Anne, or Empty ( ... )
Reply
Maybe, not so much as Nice, what he is is personal. Both Carrot and Vetinari do deal at people from a distance ("Personal isn't the same as important." - Carrot), whereas Vimes always deals with people, not ideals. Carrot can force people to do the Good thing through sheer force of will, and Vetinari can force people to do the Right thing by dint of the fact that he's the Partician. Perhaps the key to Nice is that you don't try to make people change. You accept them as they are, whatever that may be, not forcing your own views on them ( ... )
Reply
Reply
And it's possible that my 'not really a Willow fan at all' roots are showing.
Reply
Leave a comment