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[bubbleforest]

You know, the more I see it, the more I'm starting to hate the phrase Out of CharacterMostly because other people dictating how a person should be writing kind of pisses me off. There used to be a time when people were ASKING to see new character traits in whatever fandom they were in - at least they did in mine. But apparently now it's not a good

Comments

[trumpeterofdoom]

Woah. Down, girl. *pets you a lot*

[zillahseye]

This made me all thinky! Awesome.

I was thinking about something similar yesterday, that this is why I suck at betareading and why I always get neurotic about recommending fic or giving concrit or ANYTHING. Because, like, who am I? How can I say, qualitatively, that something is good? How can I tell someone they need more action or hotter sex or a better ending or more of character X? I know whether or not I like something, but doesn't that just mean the story does or doesn't fit a template of expectations I had in my head? Isn't most concrit me just saying, "Dude, you didn't write the story I wanted!"

Of course, that belief kinda invalidates my English degree, which focused on the holy duality of writing and criticism. *grin* Do you think there is such a thing, objectively, as poor characterization or a "bad" story, or is it all personal taste? (Example: I had a nice friend many years ago who wrote what I considered to be bad fiction. It had an unbelievable premise, the characterization was so eccentric I couldn't

[bubbleforest]

Wow, I have to cut my reply into two comments. How dorky do I feel right now

[zillahseye]

I do really badly with betas. I believe everything they say. I'm all "Oh God, you're right, I DO suck. I'll just. Be over here with my piece of shit fic. That will now not ever be finished because I'm painfully aware that it sucks. And the characters suck and the language sucks. And I suck. Anybody have some chains and vinegar?" Or I try to rewrite the story based on what they like, and the whole thing winds up making no sense and I lose the narrative and all my personal interest in it. This is the same reason I can pretty much kiss a fic g'bye after I post one part of it, or even show a friend parts. I'll never be able to go back to the level of comfort I required to finish it. I feel too closely watched, even if that feeling's illusory.

Welcome to even more of my neuroses: My reccing is totally random. I've read wonderful things I never rec. I don't think I've ever recced anything in popslash, first because I felt like (and was) a total n00b, and then because I was paralyzed that people would think I was snubbing

[bubbleforest]

Gah, you ask such difficult questions! *g* I do think there is such a thing as bad characterization. If you're in the fanfic 'business', and you're writing a character where you can't recognize anything but the name, then yeah, I'd say that's bad. But I don't think there's anything wrong with trying to add a little spice to the pot. I mean, Brian isn't asexual. AJ does have faith in God. Writing something where you bring out those aspects of their personalities, while still keeping them recognizable - I cannot TELL you how much I would love to read that

[withdiamonds]

There was a similar discussion the other day about writing style. Why is everything supposed to be spare and show-don't-tell and anything a bit more wordy and descriptive and romantic is criticized as "overwritten?" When did one particular style get to be the "right" way to write, and that's what gets recced, even though lots of people like a lot of different ways of writing stories?

Same kind of question, I guess. At least this discussion reminded me of the other one.

[bubbleforest]

Yeah, apparently there's a lot of discussion going on about this right now, at least if you look at metafandom. I didn't know this crossed over to writing styles as well! Except for the show-don't-tell thing, that one's been around for ages. But, gah, I LOVE reading other people's writing styles. And I love playing around with my own. Man, readers limit themselves so much when they set up these kind of 'rules.'

It's the same thing with reading only one pairing - what's wrong with imagining Character A with someone other than Character B sometimes? I mean, I'll try anything once. I read every NSYNC pairing there was when I first started out with that band (six months ago, I guess?) to find out what I liked. And hey, I'll still read a Trickyfish fic if it's good. I just don't get why people set up so many limits for themselves. Fair enough if that's what they like. It's just not for me.

[withdiamonds]

Oh, man, don't even get me started on the pairing thing. I get having favorites, but I will never understand refusing to read a certain pairing, or hating them, or thinking the people who like that pairing have some sort of major character flaw. I've been reading NSYNC for five years now, and I still don't have an OTP. Okay, Lance is my OTP, but I'll read any of the other guys in whatever combination anyone is willing to write them. I just don't understand the politics of of pairing wars. You're right, it's so limiting.

Wait, you don't like Trickyfish? What's wrong with you??!!

[bubbleforest]

BWAH! I figured I would get that reaction. :) But yeah, I have to say that when it comes to NSYNC, Lance is totally my OTP as well. So if you add Chris to the mix, I'll read it, but there are other pairings I'm much more fond of. :)

There's really no fun in it if you can't mix things up sometimes. I never understood the great R/Hr vs. H/Hr war either. I still don't know which side of that fence is crazier.

[findmeakor]

I liked reading through this. I think anything in the performing arts (and its audiences) must be taken in the subjective. Sometimes 'the masses are asses', and sometimes they've got it just right. The problem is that statement I've typed right there is all opinion, too, so you can't sit around pondering hard about negative crit and failure.

Writing is unbelievably personal; I cannot stress that enough. For example, today I had a reader of my fic tell me that she likes my work better than what is, by popular opinion, the best slash fiction for that band. Now, I don't have anything really to go by because it's what you relate to, so while you and I know what's basically bad!fic, there's a wonderful open-endedness to the world of better-than-bad fiction. Be glad about those who know just where you're coming from when you write, and ignore the bull. :)

[fly_meaway]

Ohhh I feel you on that. The 'I think' part in particular. People tend to say this is the best fic ever written or this is the best icon ever. But that's always like that to the person, not to everyone else. When someone says 'this is the worst icon ever'. Then that's also that person's opinion. I wish people would watch that a bit more.

And well, I don't really get the out of character either. I do like it when characters are very in character, but out of character can be amazing too. So yeah, I don't think people should hang on that too much either.

Basically I agree with your rant ;)