There are so many different correct answers to the question, "When were you saved?" that it barely makes any sense. Here is an incomplete list: - in the mind of God before the worlds were made - on a cross outside Jerusalem in AD 30 - in any one of the historical events that led up to, or grew from, that event - when I first believed consciously; i.e. was converted - when I was baptized into His Body, the Church - yesterday - today - tomorrow - when I die and am ushered into His Presence - at the Resurrection and Last Judgment
You are right: ignoring any of these dimensions of our salvation risks practical impotence.
a.) being saved from final judgment for our sins, and b.) being "saved" from temptations of engaging in sin in everyday life
might be helpful here -
But Yes, we must call out to Christ for rescuing from the temptations of engaging in sin in everyday life, even when our eternal security has been granted by Christ's final sacrifice. And yes, we are powerless to overcome these temptations independent of God's merciful intervention and power.
Second post I've seen today quoting Spurgeon. Today's off to a great start!
Agreed that the distinctions are both true and helpful theologically; practically, I'm left wondering if we've let those distinctions compartmentalize salvation into impotence. When someone cries to God for salvation in Scripture, how much do they seem concerned with those distinctions, and how much do they just plain need to be saved by God? Perhaps if we were more in touch with that need, within the context of the assurance we have by faith, our relationship with God and who He is/who we need Him to be in our lives would be rejuvenated a bit. Just a thought, and a bit of hope.
It's interesting that you mentioned the Old Testament historical characters in your original post, and their cries for deliverance.
In thinking over the New Testament, we do not see the same degree/amount of crying out in agony... in fact, with Stephen at his stoning as an example, we see much the opposite.
I wonder if this is a case of the difference between believers with the indwelling Holy Spirit seen in the New Testament and believers possibly lacking that same experience in the Old? Or, is it a by-product of the much-longer time period the Old Testament represents when compared to the single generation represented in the New, therefore the amount of material there is larger?
This is one of the things that I've loved about Orthodoxy...there is a parable about a little girl who approached a priest, tugged on his robe, and asked,"When were you saved?"
He laughing looked at her and said, "On a hill in 33 AD." Thus the focus is on Christ, not us...
And moreso, they say often in Orthodoxy, "I have been saved (by Christ's work), I am being saved (His continual protection & preservation), and I will be saved (on the last day, at the judgment)." I like that, too.
Salvation by faith is imperative. But who wants to boil God down to lifeguard and then leave Him on the shore while we swim our own way while here on earth?
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There are so many different correct answers to the question, "When were you saved?" that it barely makes any sense. Here is an incomplete list:
- in the mind of God before the worlds were made
- on a cross outside Jerusalem in AD 30
- in any one of the historical events that led up to, or grew from, that event
- when I first believed consciously; i.e. was converted
- when I was baptized into His Body, the Church
- yesterday
- today
- tomorrow
- when I die and am ushered into His Presence
- at the Resurrection and Last Judgment
You are right: ignoring any of these dimensions of our salvation risks practical impotence.
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a.) being saved from final judgment for our sins, and
b.) being "saved" from temptations of engaging in sin in everyday life
might be helpful here -
But Yes, we must call out to Christ for rescuing from the temptations of engaging in sin in everyday life, even when our eternal security has been granted by Christ's final sacrifice. And yes, we are powerless to overcome these temptations independent of God's merciful intervention and power.
Second post I've seen today quoting Spurgeon. Today's off to a great start!
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Reply
In thinking over the New Testament, we do not see the same degree/amount of crying out in agony... in fact, with Stephen at his stoning as an example, we see much the opposite.
I wonder if this is a case of the difference between believers with the indwelling Holy Spirit seen in the New Testament and believers possibly lacking that same experience in the Old? Or, is it a by-product of the much-longer time period the Old Testament represents when compared to the single generation represented in the New, therefore the amount of material there is larger?
Curiouser and curiouser...
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He laughing looked at her and said, "On a hill in 33 AD." Thus the focus is on Christ, not us...
And moreso, they say often in Orthodoxy, "I have been saved (by Christ's work), I am being saved (His continual protection & preservation), and I will be saved (on the last day, at the judgment)." I like that, too.
Salvation by faith is imperative. But who wants to boil God down to lifeguard and then leave Him on the shore while we swim our own way while here on earth?
Beautiful, appreciated thoughts.
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... all is well put. thank you!
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