Kardashev scale: we're bigger than U.S. Steel!

[banazir]

From a Wikipedia article I just came across for the first time while talking to twinbee about renewable resources (pursuant to my entries from 15 Mar 2006 and 25 Mar 2006):
The Kardashev scale is a general method of classifying how technologically advanced a civilization is, first proposed in 1964 by the Russian astronomer Nikolai Kardashev. It has three

Comments

[cretaceousrick]

"Able to harness" doesn't equate to actually harnessing such; there are tremendous energy resources on this planet, from wind and waves to the heat and motion of the mantle, that we barely scratch the surface of. I'd go so far as to postulate that our current civilization is Type 0, regardles of our ability to fling spacecraft beyond the reach of the solar system.

It's Type 0 all the way down

[banazir]

We are indeed Type 0, and will remain so until at least 2100 (by optimistic estimates), barring the discovery of zero-point technology or a breakthrough in fusion technology.

The transition to Type 1 presumes either fusion plants or something significant using orbital tethers (space elevators) and orbital thin solar platforms (at least a few tens of square kilometers, up to millions, i.e., beaming down a significant fraction of such energy as hits the earth).

It's humbling to reflect that all human civilization to date - Stone, Bronze, Iron Age - has all been Type 0.

--
Banazir

Zero, shmero.

[cretaceousrick]

I didn't even think of that - all the solar radiation reaching the Earth's surface (and the moon as well, if you ask me) qualifies as energy that should be harnessed before reaching a satisfactory Type I level. 2100 is optimistic. But who knows, maybe this old species will surprise us. I hope so.

Except that we can't GET all of "it"

[banazir]

It's just a numbers game, you see: there's no requirement that we collect all of the radiation on the surface of Earth itself, just harness (i.e., capture or generate) an equivalent amount.

Fusion will do, since heavy water is a far more abundant resource. Like "fresh" hydrogen and carbon (biofuels, fuel cells), it's considered renewable, even though hydrocarbons are the basis of both biofuels and fossil fuels. The definition of renewable energy requires only that "the energy resource [is] replaced quickly by a biological process", etc. (Emphasis added: in geological or even paleontological terms, fossil fuel doesn't take that long to form. In terms of civilization, biofuel takes long enough.)

We humans are full of surprises... sometimes.

--
Banazir

I love your icon

[kauricat]

It is by will alone I set my mouth in motion.
It is by the mints of Mentos that breath acquires freshness,
the lips acquire tingles; tingles become burnings.
It is by will alone I set my mouth in motion.

Mentat: The Freshmaker

[banazir]

Thanks - I'm glad you like it! Feel free to take it if you like.

Here's my "power" icon again, for clarification, since I just changed the icon to "geek" (Dr. Daniel Jackson from SG-1) while searching for an "energy"-themed icon. I will eventually migrate this to "metahumor" here on LJ and put it up on GreatestJournal.

[uncut_diamond]

I would question the placement of FTL systems in Type III - just because you've managed to find a funny trick of physics doesn't mean you're all that advanced.

FTL: a trick of physics or a steady incremental development?

[banazir]

FWIW, I agree entirely - especially considering the ghetto FTL that the Colonials have. They are always remarking on how the Vipers' FTL is weak, as is even Galactica's.

--
Banazir

[zaimoni]

The presumption is that FTL is supposed to be energetically expensive.

Of course, first we want an FTL ether (to prevent all those icky time-travel paradoxes). Then hyperdrive loses because it is at right angles to the universe (just like tachyons).

That leaves a tossup between teleportation and warp drive. Either of these could be energy-cheap, in abstraction. The only necessary energy lossage is gravity waves for both of these. And teleportation could be managed by coordinate-system-twiddling (cf. Heinlein's The Number of Beast for a reasonable speculation). The current QM approach to teleportation would be energy-intensive, as are current warp drive designs (e.g., Alcubierre).

The least energy intensive gravity wave generator that has been (claimed to be) constructed used 500MW plane sparks. Unfortunately, the authors of the paper couldn't work stress-energy tensors, thus didn't realize that their apparatus was fully within General Relativity. They promptly de-credibilized their paper by opining otherwise.

[uncut_diamond]

you know far more about this than I. My undergrad degree says science - but the word political is before it.