Comments | average_homos: Prop 8 Battle. Why?

rici_1113 in average_homos

Prop 8 Battle. Why?

Jan 11, 2010 21:09

OK, so... I'm not trying to start a flame war. Please don't make this one. I'm working on a paper for school about gay marriage. I'm wondering if there are any "average homos" that aren't really for gay marriage. Not necessarily opposed but not something they think is necessary? I'm also wondering what "average homos" think of my theory that us ( Read more... )

Comments 14

riotous_prole January 12 2010, 05:21:50 UTC

"Prop 8 took away no civil right."

Yes it did. First we had marriage, then prop 8 passed and that right was taken away. Civil right or not.

Just curious, in which light are you writing this paper?

nikolche January 12 2010, 05:38:16 UTC

Seconding this. I'm annoyed when states pass bans on gay marriage before anyone tries it, but in California they actively took away rights from people. The fact that we can do that in a country that's meant to be based on freedom for all disgusts me.

greydruid January 12 2010, 06:54:23 UTC

Well, that could be more accurately applied to the situation in Maine, where gay marriage was approved lawfully by the legislature, and then taken away by the people. In California, the privilege was granted by a court (although the legislature was willing to do it on its own), which fueled opposition.

nikolche January 12 2010, 07:04:23 UTC

Define "more accurate". In Maine no one got married. No one planned a wedding and then had it taken away from them because they went to sign the license a day too late. California isn't the only state where gay marriage was granted via court decision. You think Connecticut or Iowa residents wouldn't have overturned their ruling if they had the chance? It's possible, but history shows that it's not exactly likely.

Gay marriage opponents don't really care how it becomes law. They say they do, but the results have been the same regardless of whether it happened via the courts or the legislature. What they care about is preventing us from being married.

Thread 5

nikolche January 12 2010, 05:54:53 UTC

I don't like separate but equal. I honestly don't care if all the legal rights are the same (and they're not), by using a different name people are saying that we are inherently less than those in heterosexual relationships. People don't get all excited when you say you're filing your domestic partnership paperwork. They don't give the same weight to having a civil union. "Marriage" carries with it a level of commitment and step towards adult-hood that "civil union" and "domestic partner" don't.

Besides that, not everyone in this damned country is conservative Christian. I am Jewish. My rabbi is perfectly happy to officiate at gay weddings. The Union of Reform Judaism has allowed gay marriage since the 70s. Why is my religion less important than bigots? No one's forcing them to keep Kosher or observe Passover. No one's saying that they can't get married unless they sign a ketubah. They don't even have to officiate at gay weddings if they don't want to ( ... )

rogonandi January 12 2010, 06:30:49 UTC

We're not forcing our lifestyle down anyone's throats, we just want to be able to get married if our relationships with our lovers reach that level.

It's really very simple, and when you look at it long enough it's exactly the same reasons why straight people get married. Even if it's nothing but a 'glorified civil union', it's still good to be able to proclaim to the world that we have found someone worth entering a legally binding contract for the rest of our lives with.

With myself, being able to call Greg my husband and it being true in every sense (even legal) always feels wonderful and fills me with pride.

etre_moral January 12 2010, 07:04:11 UTC

Well, what if some gay guy does not feel that marriage is necessary for him. It's necessary for many people out there, especially for elderly couples and couples with kids. If you don't need it, that does not mean that marriages should not be an option...

And, now that I took a deep breathe, the wording "We're forcing our lifestyle down their throats" does sound a bit self-hating to me.

greydruid January 12 2010, 07:06:26 UTC

I think there's something to be said about the way the gay-marriage movement is acting in this fight. In California, for instance, they are attacking people who supported Prop 8 and generally acting like bullies trying to shout down opposition. They talk about "equality" without explaining what it means. I mean, "equality" is just a buzzword. It doesn't convince people. They simply aren't making a case for gay marriage.