Thanks, Crow! It really is a very interesting story with a lot of things going for it despite some of the more disappointing aspects.
Even though Gilda may be dead, this story (especially in the next part) established her as far more of a vital presence than she’s been in decades. Whereas she was alive but neglected and ignored by all other writers, here she dominates Harvey’s thoughts and haunts his whole being. It’s bizarre to think that this is actually not such a bad state for the character to be in, but that’s where we’re at.
And yeah, Erin’s arc is rather anticlimactic. I think Tomasi should have closed the book on her, but I fear that he got too attached to the character and wanted to leave the door open for her return. Frankly, I don’t trust anybody but Tomasi to do anything else with her, and I’d rather see her story end on a high note than to watch her become another watered-down and ignored character in canon.
I have a weird mental image of the Pre-Crisis, Long Halloween and TBB Gildas all hanging out together in the 'Animal Man' Limbo realm, playing cards and talking about their lives. I wonder how they'd get along?
I wouldn't want to hang out with TLH Gilda, would you? She has no interests of her own apart from Harvey, she's exuding a real Girl, Interrupted vibe... not even Barbara Gordon (The 1st) seems to enjoy talking to her.
While Tumblr has, admittedly, a slight advantage in enabling those of us who use it to chat about the stories as they happen, rather than the more episodic nature of LiveJournal, I can't help but feel that the LJ-only readers will get more of a kick out of these particular long reviews than we do. To a certain extent, it's sort of like a "Greatest Hits" compilation of the past two months, even including some stray observations that I and crows_talon have made ourselves - fun in a nostalgic way, and still very well-written, but ehhhhhh.
Oh, and speaking of underwhelming stuff I've created... Happy birthday, Hef.
Yeah, I'd probably feel the same way if I were in your shoes, although in my defense, I think the vast, vast majority of stuff here is new stuff that I haven't said before on Tumblr. If it weren't, then I would have probably been able to get all this posted a lot sooner. As it is, it'll probably be another week or two before I can post the full review of the second part.
Still, this is one rare occasion where I'm glad that only about five of you folks here follow me on Tumblr. Sorry if this feels like a rerun, but hey, at least you've had a head start on formulating snappy replies here in the comments!
Great review, John, you raised a lot of interesting points that I hadn't thought of. Looking forward to more, and glad I went ahead and bought parts 3-5 of this last weekend so I could follow your review.
I also caught up on 'Zero Year', and as far as I can tell, this is the only reference to Harvey:
I think you finally found the gooey Tootsie Roll center underneath Greg Capullo's gruff Lemmy-from-Motorhead image, Mothy! I have an image of him sobbing quietly while watching that episode on one of the 'Old School' DVD sets...
Regarding Harvey's relationship with Bruce, my personal take is that they still are friends in that later scene, it's just that their respective paths in life have caused them to quarrel. Remember, at the party they're still all basically college kids - their respective careers haven't actually started yet. As such, their viewpoints on certain important matters are somewhat abstract; Harvey's discussions with Bruce regarding the law probably haven't gone much further than 'Yeah, man, I'm gonna be a lawyer!' 'That's great, Harv.' I mean, heck, Bruce invited the McKillens to his party - if that's not an indication that no one there has quite settled into their future roles in life, then I don't know what is. Yeah, I also would have liked it better if Gilda had stayed a sculptress, or, at least, some sort of artist. It made a nice contrast to Harvey; it emphasized that they're different people who are following different paths in life but still love each other, as tends to happen. Also, it left a mark on his career as Two-Face,
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As always, I like your reads on these scenes. These all seem like fair and valid takes on what we’ve seen above, and it’s times like this when I really do wish the writer might pop up and chime in with what he was going for.
I do like the idea that he didn’t so much become a mob lawyer as much as agreed to defend acquaintances from school, or at least, friends of a friend, as I’m not sure that they ALL went to the same school together, did they? I’m a bit confused on that point.
And yes, I too like how the McKillens are two different kind of creeps. As I say in the next review, it’s a shame we don’t get to see more of Shannon, especially as she gets talked up as being the nicer, kinder, more gentle McKillen. It would have been interesting to have seen how that Shannon McKillen reconciled with the ruthless woman who co-ordered a hit on a whole family.
Well, Bruce does say he invited "friends and old classmates", so that implies the McKillens are one or the other. I'm not saying 'friends' is out of the question - it'd honestly be pretty interesting if it were the case - but given who and what the twins are, I'd say it's more likely that they were just classmates who Bruce and Harvey knew casually at that point. Going strictly by what I see here, I'd say it's more like she was the more rational sister - as in, she and Erin are both on the same page when it comes to... well, psycho mob stuff, but she's more likely to calmly work things through, whereas her twin is ruled by her emotions and liable to fly off the hook at any moment. It's not 'bad/good', it's 'emotion/logic
( ... )
I really don't read this as Harvey going in as an opportunistic bastard. I really don't. That panel before his blow-out with the McKillens? He looks like he's been chewed on then spat out again on many occasions, with this one being the last straw. Those pages where he lashes out at Bruce? I think Harvey was just so utterly frustrated he couldn't help but let a little of if out. I think he was moments away from not being able to look himself in the mirror anymore
( ... )
I don’t think you’re seeing things that aren’t there at all, I like your take and I think there’s truth to it. I just tend to brace myself for the absolute worst, and in this case, I’ve had over half a year to stress over what the hell Tomasi was going to do to Harvey. As it is, I like that you’re able to read all this and not see Harvey has a bastard at all, especially given how not every other reviewer and fan seems to take on as favorable a view as you do.
Those twins are atrocious people who deserve every single punch in the face they get.
And Shannon got hers, no question. Erin, on the other hand... doesn't receive much of anything, even by the very end (spoilers, y'all!). Tomasi seems so reluctant to let his favourite new toy get broken or tarnished in any serious way, which isn't typically the way writers treat a character who's this much of an asshole. The lack of catharsis is truly frustrating.
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Even though Gilda may be dead, this story (especially in the next part) established her as far more of a vital presence than she’s been in decades. Whereas she was alive but neglected and ignored by all other writers, here she dominates Harvey’s thoughts and haunts his whole being. It’s bizarre to think that this is actually not such a bad state for the character to be in, but that’s where we’re at.
And yeah, Erin’s arc is rather anticlimactic. I think Tomasi should have closed the book on her, but I fear that he got too attached to the character and wanted to leave the door open for her return. Frankly, I don’t trust anybody but Tomasi to do anything else with her, and I’d rather see her story end on a high note than to watch her become another watered-down and ignored character in canon.
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Oh, and speaking of underwhelming stuff I've created... Happy birthday, Hef.
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Still, this is one rare occasion where I'm glad that only about five of you folks here follow me on Tumblr. Sorry if this feels like a rerun, but hey, at least you've had a head start on formulating snappy replies here in the comments!
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I also caught up on 'Zero Year', and as far as I can tell, this is the only reference to Harvey:
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I think you finally found the gooey Tootsie Roll center underneath Greg Capullo's gruff Lemmy-from-Motorhead image, Mothy! I have an image of him sobbing quietly while watching that episode on one of the 'Old School' DVD sets...
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Yeah, I also would have liked it better if Gilda had stayed a sculptress, or, at least, some sort of artist. It made a nice contrast to Harvey; it emphasized that they're different people who are following different paths in life but still love each other, as tends to happen. Also, it left a mark on his career as Two-Face, ( ... )
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I do like the idea that he didn’t so much become a mob lawyer as much as agreed to defend acquaintances from school, or at least, friends of a friend, as I’m not sure that they ALL went to the same school together, did they? I’m a bit confused on that point.
And yes, I too like how the McKillens are two different kind of creeps. As I say in the next review, it’s a shame we don’t get to see more of Shannon, especially as she gets talked up as being the nicer, kinder, more gentle McKillen. It would have been interesting to have seen how that Shannon McKillen reconciled with the ruthless woman who co-ordered a hit on a whole family.
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Going strictly by what I see here, I'd say it's more like she was the more rational sister - as in, she and Erin are both on the same page when it comes to... well, psycho mob stuff, but she's more likely to calmly work things through, whereas her twin is ruled by her emotions and liable to fly off the hook at any moment. It's not 'bad/good', it's 'emotion/logic ( ... )
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(Turns to the camera, smiles, holds up pack of Mentos)
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And Shannon got hers, no question. Erin, on the other hand... doesn't receive much of anything, even by the very end (spoilers, y'all!). Tomasi seems so reluctant to let his favourite new toy get broken or tarnished in any serious way, which isn't typically the way writers treat a character who's this much of an asshole. The lack of catharsis is truly frustrating.
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