The Poetry Fishbowl project continues to develop, sprouting new options as participants make requests or say things that give me ideas
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Yeah, that's true. I look around for places that don't have a stated length limit for poems (or a high one, like 100 lines) and preferably allow batch submissions. Then I can put one or two multi-page poems in with the shorter ones, and hope something sells. But most editors will buy a short poem instead of a long one.
>>Even though I've written a plethora of small poems, I'm beginning to find the 20-30 line limits of many venues to be rather restrictive, especially when trying to tell a complex narrative through verse.<<
I hit that in the fishbowls if people give me complex prompts. If the topic is familiar, I can do it in a short poem; if I'm trying to tell a story, it takes more space. So I can totally sympathize with your dilemma.
>>It makes it hard to justify the time composing such pieces when you think they may never see publication.<<
I can see how that would happen. For me, writing is a necessity, so I write what I need to write. I prefer to write things that could sell,
( ... )
>>That fact does bother me sometimes, but I think the pathetic pay rate poetry often receives may have a lot to do with it. So much seems to revolve around pay-rate, which is in no way a true indicator of quality.<<
True. Americans have a bad habit of thinking money is everything.
>>Even the poetry requirements for active HWA membership are a bit hard to reach, considering how many markets pay less than 25 cents a line, or less than $5. And I think fewer markets take horror poetry anyway. <<
Hmm ... I didn't know that HWA membership had a poetry option. I write and read only a little horror, but my taste for it gradually growing. Any idea where I could find their parameters? And do you know if they explicitly rule out crowdfunded projects?
>>And what about those of us who write more than just horror poetry?<<
Well, the Science Fiction Poetry Association is open to writers and readers of any type of speculative poetry. They're very cosmopolitan in that regard; no publication required for membership, just the annual fee (which
( ... )
Will we not leave behind epic poems of our generation. . Where is our Canterbury tales? Where is our Scholar Gypsy?
Perhaps we should ask Carol Ann Duffy to head a campaign
I like the long poems,
I've been having problems sorting out my email (house move issues) with my ISP and paypal won't accept free email accounts like hotmail.
I would like to sponsor Call of the Cwn Annwn and Hareshotton at some point when I have it sorted. Maybe I could send you something from UK not available in US?
>>Will we not leave behind epic poems of our generation.<<
Perhaps not. Then again, if cyberfunded creativity catches on as the next great business model ... *grin* ... maybe you folks are funding them right now! The early examples of any literary movement are necessarily classics.
>>I like the long poems,<<
Yay! Thanks for letting me know.
>>I would like to sponsor Call of the Cwn Annwn and Hareshotton at some point when I have it sorted. Maybe I could send you something from UK not available in US?<<
If you can't get PayPal to work, then yes, I'd be open to barter. It would have to be something durable though; I've seen what happens to packages mailed from overseas. Two things leap readily to mind: Celtic knotwork pendants, and books. Small publishers often put out lovely books about local attractions that can't be found elsewhere -- stone circles and other historic features, local heroes, etc. Or bilingual poetry in languages I don't have a lot of, like Welsh/English or Irish/English. anything sound promising, or
( ... )
I don't know off the top of my head, we don't have a lot of independent booksellers in my area but I do know some local writers and poets, if I tap into the network they may well have suggestions.
Living in Marcher lands I may well be able to find some Welsh.
Local heroes, Mathew Webb first man to swim the English Channel comes to mind, he drowned in an attempt swim through the whirlpool rapids below Niagra Falls. I know they sell local books on him through the library. Is he someone that would interest you?
Our most notable local landmark is the Ironbridge, Is industrial Revolution a bit more recent than you were thinking of?
I do like the option to fund the longer poems. I think having a large number going at once would be too overwhelming. Personally, I prefer one at a time, but I think 3 or 4 would be a reasonable limit. I haven't funded yet, but I will when there's one I'm interested in.
While it may be particularly frustrating to be outvoted repeatedly for a poem I'm not really interested in, I do think the epics should be up as an option for the voters. It would be too painful for those who can't typically contribute to do otherwise, imo. I think routing odd-amount overflow to the epic poems is a good idea, and having it standard would make the voting a bit less complicated. I would just say "voters" in terms of credit, or leave it off altogether as implied, since it would probably always be there to one degree or another.
As always, I am impressed and grateful at the way you handle these things. :) Thank you!
>>I do like the option to fund the longer poems.<<
Okay, great.
>> I think having a large number going at once would be too overwhelming. Personally, I prefer one at a time, but I think 3 or 4 would be a reasonable limit. I haven't funded yet, but I will when there's one I'm interested in.<<
Hmm ... with those numbers, we might not actually hit the limit, unless adding more epics makes the fulfillment take a lot longer. I usually don't write very many epics per fishbowl, so there are fewer to choose from -- unless we hit an epic-prone topic like fantasy or folk tales. Right now it's taking about two months to fund an epic (based on a small sample). If we added one per month, the older ones would finish before the new ones stacked up too much. But if they were added faster or took longer, then it could build up.
The rest of your comments make sense too. Thanks for the feedback!
I'm glad to find this blog; it's been immensely inspiring to see another who has delved into the world of cyber-funded creativity and found some measure of success. I love the idea of piece-by-piece donations towards epic poems. I would donate towards the unfolding of an epic poem or a story, more likely a story, especially if I found it of great interest.
I also like the thought of general donations.
As I was reading this post, I wondered if you had ever considered the option of collecting certain of your works into a volume, and offering it/them through a print-on-demand service?
I'm sorry I haven't answered in more depth; I'm in a public place and it's very distracting! lol...
>>I'm glad to find this blog; it's been immensely inspiring to see another who has delved into the world of cyber-funded creativity and found some measure of success.<<
I'm glad too. Mutual support helps a lot -- I also frequent the blogs of several friends who are into cyberfunded creativity.
>>I love the idea of piece-by-piece donations towards epic poems. I would donate towards the unfolding of an epic poem or a story, more likely a story, especially if I found it of great interest.<<
That's encouraging. Let's see, epic themes so far have included gender balance in fantasy, fairy tale fantasy humor, xenoentomology, and now dark science fiction space monsters. Next month's fishbowl will be November 3 with the theme languages and ways of writing. What are some of your favorite topics?
>>I also like the thought of general donations.... )
One possibility would be to turn these into ebooks. . .I'd need someone to do the actual ebook file creation (as PDF or whatever) because I don't have software for that.
Well, if you're still interested in learning how to convert files of poetry into .pdf documents for e-books, you might look into this: http://createpdf.adobe.com/ The online version is only $10 a month and there's even a free trial! (Click on "Get a trial subscription" in the right-hand sidebar to create an account with Adobe that will give you access to it. :)
Comments 24
(The comment has been removed)
Yeah, that's true. I look around for places that don't have a stated length limit for poems (or a high one, like 100 lines) and preferably allow batch submissions. Then I can put one or two multi-page poems in with the shorter ones, and hope something sells. But most editors will buy a short poem instead of a long one.
>>Even though I've written a plethora of small poems, I'm beginning to find the 20-30 line limits of many venues to be rather restrictive, especially when trying to tell a complex narrative through verse.<<
I hit that in the fishbowls if people give me complex prompts. If the topic is familiar, I can do it in a short poem; if I'm trying to tell a story, it takes more space. So I can totally sympathize with your dilemma.
>>It makes it hard to justify the time composing such pieces when you think they may never see publication.<<
I can see how that would happen. For me, writing is a necessity, so I write what I need to write. I prefer to write things that could sell, ( ... )
Reply
(The comment has been removed)
True. Americans have a bad habit of thinking money is everything.
>>Even the poetry requirements for active HWA membership are a bit hard to reach, considering how many markets pay less than 25 cents a line, or less than $5. And I think fewer markets take horror poetry anyway. <<
Hmm ... I didn't know that HWA membership had a poetry option. I write and read only a little horror, but my taste for it gradually growing. Any idea where I could find their parameters? And do you know if they explicitly rule out crowdfunded projects?
>>And what about those of us who write more than just horror poetry?<<
Well, the Science Fiction Poetry Association is open to writers and readers of any type of speculative poetry. They're very cosmopolitan in that regard; no publication required for membership, just the annual fee (which ( ... )
Reply
.
Where is our Canterbury tales?
Where is our Scholar Gypsy?
Perhaps we should ask Carol Ann Duffy to head a campaign
I like the long poems,
I've been having problems sorting out my email (house move issues) with my ISP and paypal won't accept free email accounts like hotmail.
I would like to sponsor Call of the Cwn Annwn and Hareshotton at some point when I have it sorted. Maybe I could send you something from UK not available in US?
Reply
Perhaps not. Then again, if cyberfunded creativity catches on as the next great business model ... *grin* ... maybe you folks are funding them right now! The early examples of any literary movement are necessarily classics.
>>I like the long poems,<<
Yay! Thanks for letting me know.
>>I would like to sponsor Call of the Cwn Annwn and Hareshotton at some point when I have it sorted. Maybe I could send you something from UK not available in US?<<
If you can't get PayPal to work, then yes, I'd be open to barter. It would have to be something durable though; I've seen what happens to packages mailed from overseas. Two things leap readily to mind: Celtic knotwork pendants, and books. Small publishers often put out lovely books about local attractions that can't be found elsewhere -- stone circles and other historic features, local heroes, etc. Or bilingual poetry in languages I don't have a lot of, like Welsh/English or Irish/English. anything sound promising, or ( ... )
Reply
Living in Marcher lands I may well be able to find some Welsh.
Local heroes, Mathew Webb first man to swim the English Channel comes to mind, he drowned in an attempt swim through the whirlpool rapids below Niagra Falls. I know they sell local books on him through the library. Is he someone that would interest you?
Our most notable local landmark is the Ironbridge, Is industrial Revolution a bit more recent than you were thinking of?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/shropshire/content/articles/2005/10/10/george_evans_feature.shtml might interest you Our local market charter is over 800 years old.
Reply
While it may be particularly frustrating to be outvoted repeatedly for a poem I'm not really interested in, I do think the epics should be up as an option for the voters. It would be too painful for those who can't typically contribute to do otherwise, imo. I think routing odd-amount overflow to the epic poems is a good idea, and having it standard would make the voting a bit less complicated. I would just say "voters" in terms of credit, or leave it off altogether as implied, since it would probably always be there to one degree or another.
As always, I am impressed and grateful at the way you handle these things. :) Thank you!
Reply
Okay, great.
>> I think having a large number going at once would be too overwhelming. Personally, I prefer one at a time, but I think 3 or 4 would be a reasonable limit. I haven't funded yet, but I will when there's one I'm interested in.<<
Hmm ... with those numbers, we might not actually hit the limit, unless adding more epics makes the fulfillment take a lot longer. I usually don't write very many epics per fishbowl, so there are fewer to choose from -- unless we hit an epic-prone topic like fantasy or folk tales. Right now it's taking about two months to fund an epic (based on a small sample). If we added one per month, the older ones would finish before the new ones stacked up too much. But if they were added faster or took longer, then it could build up.
The rest of your comments make sense too. Thanks for the feedback!
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I also like the thought of general donations.
As I was reading this post, I wondered if you had ever considered the option of collecting certain of your works into a volume, and offering it/them through a print-on-demand service?
I'm sorry I haven't answered in more depth; I'm in a public place and it's very distracting! lol...
Reply
I'm glad too. Mutual support helps a lot -- I also frequent the blogs of several friends who are into cyberfunded creativity.
>>I love the idea of piece-by-piece donations towards epic poems. I would donate towards the unfolding of an epic poem or a story, more likely a story, especially if I found it of great interest.<<
That's encouraging. Let's see, epic themes so far have included gender balance in fantasy, fairy tale fantasy humor, xenoentomology, and now dark science fiction space monsters. Next month's fishbowl will be November 3 with the theme languages and ways of writing. What are some of your favorite topics?
>>I also like the thought of general donations.
Reply
Well, if you're still interested in learning how to convert files of poetry into .pdf documents for e-books, you might look into this: http://createpdf.adobe.com/ The online version is only $10 a month and there's even a free trial! (Click on "Get a trial subscription" in the right-hand sidebar to create an account with Adobe that will give you access to it. :)
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