I don't like the way they're regressing Dean, either. Dean has grown up a lot since S1/S2, but the current group of writers seem to think Sam being back = Dean is 26 again.
I don't like the way they're regressing Dean, either. Dean has grown up a lot since S1/S2, but the current group of writers seem to think Sam being back = Dean is 26 again.
THANK YOU! This irritates me so much along with the fact that they wrote so selfish and douchey. Just another reason I quit watching.
Positives! Dean is pretty. Sam is pretty. Sam and Dean are pretty together. There are still plenty a moments where I enjoy the show, but suspect there's a serious case of group-think going on in the writers' room.
I don’t mean to come in here and cover the whole place with my inherent gleefulness though
Feel free. :) I'm always happy to see that other people enjoyed episodes that didn't really work for me. It's when everyone dislikes an episode or a plot that I get worried.
I would have called that the ideal amount of Cas except that I had to endure that asinine speech AGAIN and I couldn't reach through the screen to throttle him.
I don't think the writers really blame Sam for what he did. They're just showing the fact that Sam's blaming himself. And others. I think it's wonderful that Dean doesn't blame him, because I don't think he ever would. Still confused about Bobby though. And Sam is Sam (yay!), he always blames himself.
Castiel might just think that it's too cruel to take Sam back from hell, when his soul's been so tortured. It might just be some kind of weird angel logic. That's what I see it as, because it makes no sense at all to leave Sam's soul there to be even more tortured.
Whoops, I accidentially sent that without being done. Oh well.
I really liked the episode, like always. And I think it's going back to the feelings of the earlier seasons. So I'm happy =) About Sam's wall breaking so soon, I was surprised. But death said, don't poke at it, and Sam kind of did.
I'm very intersested into see what happens next, hope it will get better for you! It's always nice to read your thoughts =) And feel better too, I'm sorry to hear you were/is sick.
I don't think the writers really blame Sam for what he did.
Between Bobby's words last week and Sam's absolute conviction that he's responsible for everything Not!Sam did, I'm pretty sure the writers are saying it's all Sam's fault. Or that he should behave as if it is.
Castiel might just think that it's too cruel to take Sam back from hell, when his soul's been so tortured.
Yeah but... the alternative was leaving him down there to be tortured for all of eternity! Even if he returned to life only to live a short miserable span as a vegetable, as least his soul would be free from torment. Cas' argument makes no sense to me, none at all.
I'm totally with you that Castiels argument makes no sense, I was just trying to make it...make sense, haha. Just me and my little thinking. But I am as confused as anyone why it would be better to leave Sam in the cage.
I don't think soulless!Sam was only a walking corpse. That was indeed both his body and his mind walking around. So while, yes, none of what he did soulless is his 'fault' I do think he bears a degree of 'responsibility.' To me it's a great demonstration of his growth as a character that he is willing to own this. And even more so a reflection of Dean's growth that Dean will let him.
That doesn't mean Sam should wallow in guilt. It's more a matter of acceptance. And trying to do as much good now as he can.
Anyway, that's my fanwank and I'm stickin' to it ;)
More importantly, did anyone else think Jensen looked absolutely glowingly gorgeous when interviewing that blonde girl? I couldn't stop staring. He looked so young. He looks like the younger brother now!
I agree that I hope they keep the soulless!Sam flashies to a minimum going forward. But -- the bathroom sex scene? UNF-and- a-half! Plus, I had to rewind when the gal said 'cuff me' because really I heard something else. Did everyone hear something else?
I agree, Jensen looked amazing in this episode. Has he always been this pretty? I swear, that boy takes my breath away and you're right, he does look younger than Jared right now.
That was indeed both his body and his mind walking around. So while, yes, none of what he did soulless is his 'fault' I do think he bears a degree of 'responsibility.'
I just don't see it. I saw Not!Sam as having nothing in common with our Sam except what he was able to fake, and he admitted to Dean that he was faking every bit of humanity that he displayed. I don't see Sam being responsible for Not!Sam's actions any more than I blamed my grandfather for his behavior after he had a stroke.
I agree. It was out of Sam's control. And yes. They were totally different. (Huge kudos to Jared for that!). But ... gotta keep going back to the fact that Sam (our Sam!) would feel the sense of responsibility for what his soulless mind and body were up to. More so than when he was possessed by Meg, for instance, when only his body was involved.
So my point was more that it seemed in character for Sam. Not so much that I agreed with Sam's guilt. In fact, I hope he comes to peace with all of it sooner rather than later. Same as Dean seemingly did with his actions in Hell. Similar argument can be made re Dean and his torturing in Hell. Although Sam was even more innocent so to speak.
And, of course, Sam knows how he was all through season 4 -- when it was all Sam. I like the way the Show is building on its stories. It feels organic and complete. And I think it'll ultimately play well when watched straight through on DVD.
Back to the important stuff ;) -- Jensen gets more gorgeous every season. It's uncanny.
So long as Jensen is on my screen, I'm in. I've come to the conclusion that I will put up with a lot of silliness to watch Jensen. It's almost... supernatural, how pretty and appealing he is. :)
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Honestly, I am just growing of the way they treat Dean's character. It's like the complete reverse of how he was before.
Like the writers are attempting to make Sam seem more sympathetic by making Dean a douchebag. Unfortunately, In my case, it's backfiring.
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THANK YOU! This irritates me so much along with the fact that they wrote so selfish and douchey. Just another reason I quit watching.
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Positives! Dean is pretty. Sam is pretty. Sam and Dean are pretty together. There are still plenty a moments where I enjoy the show, but suspect there's a serious case of group-think going on in the writers' room.
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Feel free. :) I'm always happy to see that other people enjoyed episodes that didn't really work for me. It's when everyone dislikes an episode or a plot that I get worried.
I would have called that the ideal amount of Cas except that I had to endure that asinine speech AGAIN and I couldn't reach through the screen to throttle him.
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Castiel might just think that it's too cruel to take Sam back from hell, when his soul's been so tortured. It might just be some kind of weird angel logic. That's what I see it as, because it makes no sense at all to leave Sam's soul there to be even more tortured.
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I really liked the episode, like always. And I think it's going back to the feelings of the earlier seasons. So I'm happy =)
About Sam's wall breaking so soon, I was surprised. But death said, don't poke at it, and Sam kind of did.
I'm very intersested into see what happens next, hope it will get better for you! It's always nice to read your thoughts =)
And feel better too, I'm sorry to hear you were/is sick.
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Between Bobby's words last week and Sam's absolute conviction that he's responsible for everything Not!Sam did, I'm pretty sure the writers are saying it's all Sam's fault. Or that he should behave as if it is.
Castiel might just think that it's too cruel to take Sam back from hell, when his soul's been so tortured.
Yeah but... the alternative was leaving him down there to be tortured for all of eternity! Even if he returned to life only to live a short miserable span as a vegetable, as least his soul would be free from torment. Cas' argument makes no sense to me, none at all.
But I'm glad that you enjoyed the episode! :)
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Just me and my little thinking. But I am as confused as anyone why it would be better to leave Sam in the cage.
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That doesn't mean Sam should wallow in guilt. It's more a matter of acceptance. And trying to do as much good now as he can.
Anyway, that's my fanwank and I'm stickin' to it ;)
More importantly, did anyone else think Jensen looked absolutely glowingly gorgeous when interviewing that blonde girl? I couldn't stop staring. He looked so young. He looks like the younger brother now!
I agree that I hope they keep the soulless!Sam flashies to a minimum going forward. But -- the bathroom sex scene? UNF-and- a-half! Plus, I had to rewind when the gal said 'cuff me' because really I heard something else. Did everyone hear something else?
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That was indeed both his body and his mind walking around. So while, yes, none of what he did soulless is his 'fault' I do think he bears a degree of 'responsibility.'
I just don't see it. I saw Not!Sam as having nothing in common with our Sam except what he was able to fake, and he admitted to Dean that he was faking every bit of humanity that he displayed. I don't see Sam being responsible for Not!Sam's actions any more than I blamed my grandfather for his behavior after he had a stroke.
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So my point was more that it seemed in character for Sam. Not so much that I agreed with Sam's guilt. In fact, I hope he comes to peace with all of it sooner rather than later. Same as Dean seemingly did with his actions in Hell. Similar argument can be made re Dean and his torturing in Hell. Although Sam was even more innocent so to speak.
And, of course, Sam knows how he was all through season 4 -- when it was all Sam. I like the way the Show is building on its stories. It feels organic and complete. And I think it'll ultimately play well when watched straight through on DVD.
Back to the important stuff ;) -- Jensen gets more gorgeous every season. It's uncanny.
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