Finally, Starkiller Base: Okay, so they can CLEARLY terraform a planet, and they can CLEARLY aim the damn thing, and the Death Stars were both hyper-capable, so there's no particular reason they can't have put a hyperdrive on it. And the "it eats a star to provide power for the laser" is KIND OF AWESOME, as was the "as long as there's light, there's hope" part and the fact that the star re-ignited once the energy left storage (it should have exploded more but OMG HEY THEY GOT SOMETHING PHYSICS-ISH MOSTLY RIGHT I WILL TAKE IT).
But, uh, how did they charge up the first shot? And why not recharge (then move to a new star so the biosphere stays inhabitable) immediately after firing the first shot? Speaking of which, something with an atmosphere going into hyperspace makes me wonder how much of the air and trees and shit would be left, cf Falcon vs Tentacle Monster, but that's a smaller issue.
I'm assuming charging, storage, and discharging don't necessarily take up an entire sun's worth of energy.
I can see failsafes keeping the energy of the sun from exploding right up until it's stable enough then finally giving out as it vapourizes.
What I *can't* get out of my mind are those bolts of energy coming out of the Starkiller... visibly... then splitting... then being watched as they crawled across the sky... so visible on a human-eye scale... hitting several targets in close proximity...
Were they all in the same system? No, because they'd see their own star get sucked up... I... I can't even... faster-than-light emissions visible... AIEEEE
Yeah, that's a classic Abrams-ism: ABSOLUTELY no sense of time, distance, velocity, scale, population, the laws of physics, the tendency of light to go in a straight line whenever it can.... Basically, if it's possible for something to have a number, JJ Abrams will always both specify that number and have that number be the *dumbest possible number* that contradicts *as many things as possible* for that value.
Oh, and: I'm assuming charging, storage, and discharging don't necessarily take up an entire sun's worth of energy.
Well, sure, so they only used part of the sun for the first shot, which might also be why their world is so cold and snowy at the moment.
But then they're going to use the ENTIRE star for the second shot? Which will be their last shot, rendering their planet a lifeless frozen husk and making their superweapon useless, in an entire galaxy of people who just say them nuke 5-8 planets and who know that they have from now until the next Starkiller is built (so, a few decades then) to destroy the New Order?
Nah, in order for the Starkiller to not be the most counterproductive superweapon of all time, in a universe that's already had *two* Death Stars and a droid army? The entire planet has to be mobile.
'Nah, in order for the Starkiller to not be the most counterproductive superweapon of all time, in a universe that's already had *two* Death Stars and a droid army? The entire planet has to be mobile.'
Yeah, if they can deplete a star... fuck, nevermind that, what about the amount of time it would have taken those shots to have hit their targets if they aren't in the system, assuming lightspeed? What, years? Decades? Far better to arrive in-system, and blow your targets away.
They actually do bother to cover that one - it fires the blast through Hyperspace, meaning it's going FTL in exactly the same way as all the ships go FTL. The Dude From Stargate Universe says so during the briefing.
This is handwavy Star Wars Physics, but at least they handwaved it.
(This also kind of explains why people can see it in real-time as it moves: The light coming off the blast in all directions is ALSO moving FTL and leaking out of hyperspace into realspace)
To be clear, I'm making up the bit about "this is why you can see it crawl in normal light" but the bit about the blast going FTL in hyperspace was definitely in the movie.
And neither of those excuses why the beam splits, or why "The Republic" is only 5 planets, or why 100% of all Republic Navy ships are docked on those planets at the time, or where they got the power for the first shot, or why they didn't reload immediately, or why they didn't move, or how the Resistance can see what's happening in the far-off system in real-time, or why nobody suspected that a planetary engineering project from a dangerous cult much smaller than the Empire ever was didn't ping on ANYONE'S radar, or.....
Massive plot holes, bad worldbuilding, and Did Not Do The Math all the way down. But at least "the beam reaches the target in reasonable time" got a handwave.
'why 100% of all Republic Navy ships are docked on those planets at the time'
They were?
Part of General Hitlerface's speech was about how they would be destroying the Republic navy, and then Leia (or someone else with her in the briefing? I forget?) mentions there's no Republic navy to call on for reinforcements which is why it's only the Resistance's total of 30 tiny ships attacking the new Death Star.
'where they got the power for the first shot'
Pre-charged?
And NOBODY NOTICED THEM EATING THE FIRST STAR? (Yeah, okay, the universe is big so they probably just ate a small out of the way one that nobody was looking at)
I'm hoping for spy satellites with FTL comms.The problem is FTL comms are apparently *supremely* expensive in the Star Wars universe. You know who we see using those in the first 6 movies
( ... )
One note: Leia's point about not having the Republic Navy to call on, wasn't because it was destroyed. It's because 'The Resistance' != 'The Republic'. The Republic doesn't see the First Order as a threat so the Resistance was established with covert Rebellion support, but nothing more. And apparently, despite y'know blowing up planets, that situation didn't change by the time they needed to act against StarKiller Base.
General Hitlerface to troops: We shall destroy the Republic navy! Fire! [fires] General Hitlerface to Supreme Leader Gollum: We have destroyed the Republic and it's navy! Stargate Universe Guy: There's no Republic navy to help us!
If they wanted it to be "the Republic Navy is unable to get here in time" (blatantly false, given other travel times), they should have said so. If it was "The Republic Navy has no orders to help us" (probably true!) they should have said so. If it was "We've called the Republic Navy but they're in disarray and haven't responded yet" they should have said so.
I'm just saying, "there's still a Republic" and "there's still a Republic Navy" are both statements that are unsupported by the film itself, even though they *should* be true.
I might be misremembering what the dialog was - but I don't think I am, because I remember thinking "what? that makes NO SENSE AT ALL" at the time, too.
Finally, Starkiller Base: Okay, so they can CLEARLY terraform a planet, and they can CLEARLY aim the damn thing, and the Death Stars were both hyper-capable, so there's no particular reason they can't have put a hyperdrive on it. And the "it eats a star to provide power for the laser" is KIND OF AWESOME, as was the "as long as there's light, there's hope" part and the fact that the star re-ignited once the energy left storage (it should have exploded more but OMG HEY THEY GOT SOMETHING PHYSICS-ISH MOSTLY RIGHT I WILL TAKE IT).
But, uh, how did they charge up the first shot? And why not recharge (then move to a new star so the biosphere stays inhabitable) immediately after firing the first shot? Speaking of which, something with an atmosphere going into hyperspace makes me wonder how much of the air and trees and shit would be left, cf Falcon vs Tentacle Monster, but that's a smaller issue.
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I can see failsafes keeping the energy of the sun from exploding right up until it's stable enough then finally giving out as it vapourizes.
What I *can't* get out of my mind are those bolts of energy coming out of the Starkiller... visibly... then splitting... then being watched as they crawled across the sky... so visible on a human-eye scale... hitting several targets in close proximity...
Were they all in the same system? No, because they'd see their own star get sucked up... I... I can't even... faster-than-light emissions visible... AIEEEE
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I'm assuming charging, storage, and discharging don't necessarily take up an entire sun's worth of energy.
Well, sure, so they only used part of the sun for the first shot, which might also be why their world is so cold and snowy at the moment.
But then they're going to use the ENTIRE star for the second shot? Which will be their last shot, rendering their planet a lifeless frozen husk and making their superweapon useless, in an entire galaxy of people who just say them nuke 5-8 planets and who know that they have from now until the next Starkiller is built (so, a few decades then) to destroy the New Order?
Nah, in order for the Starkiller to not be the most counterproductive superweapon of all time, in a universe that's already had *two* Death Stars and a droid army? The entire planet has to be mobile.
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Yeah, if they can deplete a star... fuck, nevermind that, what about the amount of time it would have taken those shots to have hit their targets if they aren't in the system, assuming lightspeed? What, years? Decades? Far better to arrive in-system, and blow your targets away.
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This is handwavy Star Wars Physics, but at least they handwaved it.
(This also kind of explains why people can see it in real-time as it moves: The light coming off the blast in all directions is ALSO moving FTL and leaking out of hyperspace into realspace)
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Nick Mamatas has a much less charitable review... and seems to have missed a helluva lot more than I did.
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And neither of those excuses why the beam splits, or why "The Republic" is only 5 planets, or why 100% of all Republic Navy ships are docked on those planets at the time, or where they got the power for the first shot, or why they didn't reload immediately, or why they didn't move, or how the Resistance can see what's happening in the far-off system in real-time, or why nobody suspected that a planetary engineering project from a dangerous cult much smaller than the Empire ever was didn't ping on ANYONE'S radar, or.....
Massive plot holes, bad worldbuilding, and Did Not Do The Math all the way down. But at least "the beam reaches the target in reasonable time" got a handwave.
It's not a Nicoll-Dyson Laser, is my point.
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They were?
Part of General Hitlerface's speech was about how they would be destroying the Republic navy, and then Leia (or someone else with her in the briefing? I forget?) mentions there's no Republic navy to call on for reinforcements which is why it's only the Resistance's total of 30 tiny ships attacking the new Death Star.
'where they got the power for the first shot'
Pre-charged?
And NOBODY NOTICED THEM EATING THE FIRST STAR?
(Yeah, okay, the universe is big so they probably just ate a small out of the way one that nobody was looking at)
I'm hoping for spy satellites with FTL comms.The problem is FTL comms are apparently *supremely* expensive in the Star Wars universe. You know who we see using those in the first 6 movies ( ... )
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(Extra thing while on the topic of actors: The stormtrooper who releases Rey, the one who drops his gun and leaves the door open? Daniel Craig.)
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[fires]
General Hitlerface to Supreme Leader Gollum: We have destroyed the Republic and it's navy!
Stargate Universe Guy: There's no Republic navy to help us!
If they wanted it to be "the Republic Navy is unable to get here in time" (blatantly false, given other travel times), they should have said so. If it was "The Republic Navy has no orders to help us" (probably true!) they should have said so. If it was "We've called the Republic Navy but they're in disarray and haven't responded yet" they should have said so.
I'm just saying, "there's still a Republic" and "there's still a Republic Navy" are both statements that are unsupported by the film itself, even though they *should* be true.
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Well fine, if you insist on being right, just be right then.
:)
Nothing in my memory of the film counters your statements. I guess I'll just need to rewatch it to see if you're wrong (you're probably not wrong).
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