Workshop: How to use and/or be a vid beta

[ash48]

Hi.

I'm ash48. I make fanvids. I always use a vid beta so I thought it might be fun to talk about what a vid beta does and how to use a one. I've asked counteragent to help me out with the section on being a vid beta because she's got more experience in that area and has a great approach to vid beta-ing.

Comments

[galwithglasses]

This is really cool to read about and then to see the examples of how the vid changed over time. You always make it seem so effortless and seeing the behind-the-scenes stuff makes me realize how much really goes into it. The beta tips are great for any kind of beta. Thanks for posting this.

[ash48]

Thanks. :)

There's usually a few sections in a vid I change after getting back some notes. Sometimes changing one section has a knock on effect of changing another.

With that above vid one of my very first attempt (before that first draft) had wee!Sam throwing his hands in the air on the matching lyric but I thought it might have been too "obvious". Later on counteragent mentioned that it would be a good match their so I put it back in. :)

[harrigan]

That was really fascinating! And so much of it translates to story beta'ing too -- esp. that it's helpful to establish those ground rules each time, because there are different levels of beta'ing possible, and that it can take several rounds to polish and tweak the same work.

Seeing the concrete example was cool.

Two questions!

1. I sometimes see in fic stories that are beta'd... but I feel as though the beta was perhaps a supportive friend of the author who didn't really have the technical skills to do what was needed. The posted story might be better than it was before beta-ing, but there's still a lot of room for improvement. Assuming a vidder wants a genuine coach to help make it the best it can be -- what's the best way to find someone with those skills and availability? You said you put a request on supernaturalvid several years ago. Is that still the best/only way? Do you have any other suggestions

[cupidsbow]

Jumping in to respond to Q2: it's fairly common practice to host the draft vid on a filesharing site like Mediafire, and email the download link to the beta. I've used this method as both vidder and beta, working with several different people, but haven't ever beta'd via a streaming vid on YouTube or a similar service. This is an easy option for several reasons, but the biggest is probably quality -- It's harder to see subtleties on streaming vids, like stray frames.

[ash48]

I'm glad you found it interesting. I suspect there is a lot of similarities between fic and vid beta'ing.

yay questions!

1. I was super lucky when I posted my requested all those years ago. I had only just started vidding and I needed someone to look over a vid I knew needed a lot of work. _sharvie_ responded. She was an amazing beta. She used to give me reams on notes - but I loved them.

I would say that if you didn't know anyone at all then putting a request on supernaturalvid or on vidding would be a good way to start. (In fact I just saw such a request on viddingHowever, approaching someone is also a great way to go. I mean, I suppose it can be tricky asking someone you consider a friend for fear that they might not be absolutely honest but I'd say you'd be a good judge of whether they would be or not. Also, you could always see who betas other peoples vids. If you see them around the place a bit the chances are they'd be pretty good and don't mind doing it

[counteragent]

Offer to beta for people first, learn from them, then rack up "beta points" so they are likely to help you when you need it. :)

[counteragent]

LOL Drunk santa + Sarah M music. You are a brave soul for putting that up there! I adore you and everything you do for fandom!

One comment I wanted to make in response to your point about acknowledging your beta:

Yes, please! You do this very well and it is much appreciated. As a vid beta, I find feedback on beta feedback during the process is extra nice. I do NOT expect anyone to fawn over every little comment I make (that would be creepy and annoying) or even to try out everything I suggest. Sometimes my suggestions suck or are not right for the piece. But I find that without any back and forth, the process is not very satisfying to me. I am interested in fostering an exchange of ideas and sharing a process, not just sending my thoughts over a wall. My favorite beta exchanges are the ones where I learn something about an author/vidder's process. Invariably I also learn lessons about vidding and writing that I can apply to my own work.

[cupidsbow]

I totally agree here. With my vidding hat on, I like to say, "that was great feedback -- it really helped" so the beta knows what kind of things I'm looking. And as a beta, it's not only nice to hear, but helps me get a sense of what the vidder needs, so I can focus my comments

[ash48]

Hee...yeah. Bad choice that one.../o\ (and you know, the only reason I put that there was because of the boys being together and Sam touching Dean. When I looked back on it just now I didn't even notice that...)

But I find that without any back and forth, the process is not very satisfying to me. I am interested in fostering an exchange of ideas and sharing a process, not just sending my thoughts over a wall.

Exactly. It's all about the communication for me and that creative process. I love it when a note or suggestion can cascade into other ideas. I also love the brainstorming approach where ideas are thrown around - some work and some don't.

I live my the saying - "I not only use all the brains I have but all that I can borrow".

Also - saying thanks or at least acknowledging the work is the least anyone can do I think. I know many people are busy but we do this for free so gratitude is, in someways, payment.

Thanks again for your awesome tips. <3

[deirdre_c]

Terrific workshop! Fabulous suggestions! Which is only to be expected from two of the most talented vidders I know. *bows at your feet*

Anyway, I just thought I would encourage new vidders not to be shy about asking for beta advice. There are lots and lots of vidders out there-- not even necessarily in SPN fandom-- who are passionate about vidding and interested in welcoming new vidders and giving them a helping hand. I remember the first time I tried vidding, I had the sheer nerve to cold email sockkpuppett (aka Luminosity, aka one of the most highly regarded vidders in any fandom ever) and ask her to look at my rough cut. And she actually did! And she let me know, gently, that it was a hot mess! lol

[ash48]

Thanks hun! So glad you thought so.

And ha! Yes...getting up the guts to approach a well known and highly regarded vidder takes some courage. But I think the saying - "you don't know if you don't ask" and "they can only say no" works a treat. Also, I find most people are usually flattered to be asked. It's a nice compliment I think. (I love it because it means I get to see some awesome vids before anyone else does!)

it's particularly other vidders who will have the technical vocabulary to make very specific suggestions that can help you become a better vidder.

Yes. Very much so. I think it's good to make that distinction also. Friends or non-vidders can make great cheerleaders but I think getting the technical feedback (especially when starting out) is so valuable.

Thanks so much for your thoughts honey.
xoxo

[bradcpu]

Wonderful suggestions, all, and a great read.

One thing I've been guilty of is not allowing time for a proper beta process. It's never fun for the beta to get an email saying "Here it is. And I'm supposed to submit it by Friday." When using a beta, I now try to make sure that I allow enough time for a back-and-forth between draft 1 and my planned posting/con submission date. If I *don't* have that time, I won't ask someone to beta.

Another thing I've noticed is that if I've only *just* finished a first draft, I'm often too close to the vid to understand or accept Big Beta Changes. So it also helps to build in time to step back and detach from the vid so that you can see it a little more objectively. I can't count the number of times that I've released a vid and looked back months or years later and thought "I really should have changed such-and-such" - the types of things betas may have pointed out during the process, but that I wasn't ready to accept.

[cupidsbow]

If I *don't* have that time, I won't ask someone to beta.

There does come a point where it isn't worth asking for feedback, I agree. That said, I've got better at saying, "My turnaround time is X, so what I need is a superficial check for obvious issues as there's no time for substantive changes."

Betas are fine with this, as long as they know up front, and they do pick up really useful things at this level, which are doable in the timeframe.

[ash48]

Thanks! We're glad you thought so. :)

So it also helps to build in time to step back and detach from the vid so that you can see it a little more objectively.

This is such a great point. I used to be in such a rush to get an opinion on my first draft (well, actually I still am to a degree) that I wouldn't allow the necessary few days to let it sit and come back to it later. I'm getting better at that because it's so much easier to see what needs to be changed after taking a break.

Thank you so much for dropping by and sharing this.