To Crit or not to Crit?
anonymous
February 26 2010, 17:12:58 UTC
Here's a question I've been pondering since KM2: What do anons think of constructive criticism on the (or any, really) meme?
My gut reaction is no. While some fantastic stories come out of the meme, it's often true that what gets submitted here isn't the polished version that may appear on someone's LJ at a later date, and things that could be pointed out here may already be known to the author, who was going to fix it in post anyway.
My other reason for a no is the whole idea that fills are basically gift fic, and it's never polite to comment on a gift. But at the same time, I think it's safe to say that most KMers enjoy writing and want to improve their skill. To that end, would constructive criticism, even on a gift fic, still be offensive?
Re: To Crit or not to Crit?
anonymous
February 26 2010, 18:49:53 UTC
From my understanding, if the author says "concrit appreciated" or something along those lines, it's appropriate to leave it within the thread. Otherwise, concrit would probably be appreciated on a private, case-by-case basis.
Personally I love concrit more than squee-filled comments because it gives me a chance to defend and/or reflect upon my writing and shows me that the reader really has read and does care about what she's read. It's really flattering that someone would take the time to craft together a response that is more than just a squee.
Re: To Crit or not to Crit?
anonymous
February 26 2010, 19:51:52 UTC
I usually don't offer any unless the author asks for it, simply because like you said, these are all basically 'gift fics'. If the writing is bad it doesn't bother me; I'll either not read it, or just smile that some new writer has come out of their shell to have fun on the KM. It's not like someone's writing skill on here has any dire consequences for anybody IRL :P
So, writer anons...Ask for concrit and you shall receive.
Re: To Crit or not to Crit?
anonymous
February 26 2010, 22:33:21 UTC
I don't usually post concrit on here... or anywhere, in fact, unless it's requested. If I don't like what I'm reading, I just hit the back button. Luckily that doesn't happen too often here! :)
That being said, I'm always kinda shaky on how my own writing is perceived, so next time I make a post I may add a "concrit welcome" note to see what people say!
Is it just me, or is Watchmen preternaturally well-suited to rule 63?
I never had much interest in rule 63 before, but once I got into this fandom it became quite interesting and appealing. Wanda in particular is a mind-bogglingly interesting character.
I'm also happy about the amount of het and femmeslash that rule 63 generates, in many fandoms it seems girls get completely ignored, or that the het/femmeslash fics aren't very interesting.
I also enjoy the fanon names for our 63'd characters, haha.
Re: Rule 63.
anonymous
February 27 2010, 02:09:31 UTC
I am so, SO glad that Watchmen fandom (at least on the KM...I don't touch FF.net anymore *shudders*) doesn't employ the "Die for our Ship" trope at all. Sure there have been stories where the other potential suitor dies before the story proper begins, but it's always dealt with as a real, tragic death, as opposed to some fic where the surviving pair may dwell on it for about 30 seconds before curing their kind-of sadness with hot hot sex.
Re: Rule 63.
anonymous
February 27 2010, 17:02:40 UTC
All the skillfully done 63!fic really delights me. Some fandoms fall into the trap of "it's just character x, but with a massive rack!" or by throwing characterization out the window. I love all the places where people are almost brainstorming and sharing a common fanon for the 63!characters, and it's almost like a cast of characters within the cast.
What goes in the kinkmeme...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 01:11:05 UTC
What do people think should go into the kinkmeme, what are their preferences? Have there been times when an author/prompter has crossed the line for you? Given that I think most people are very broadly accepting anyway, I'm curious as to see if there are limits, even if it's on a very personal, 'I usually keep it to myself, but since you're asking,' basis. Not asking in order to set limits to the kinks, god no, just nosy
( ... )
Re: What goes in the kinkmeme...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 01:53:42 UTC
I recall a similar discussion on...KM2, I think, where the general consensus was this: The KM is so great because we don't discriminate against certain prompts, even if they're not specifically "kinks". I mean, just think of all the great fics we wouldn't have if we'd made this place kink only! No Swords and Sorcery, not Cats of NY, no HS AU, no Brushstrokes, no Cowboy Verse...the list goes on. Watchmen is the first KM I've ever participated in, and I know for a fact that I wouldn't still be in this fandom today if this place weren't so freaking great.
As for prompts that squick me: my years in anime fandoms have pretty much desensitized me to even the most obscene spectacles the mind can conjure. There are certainly prompts I don't prefer-- I'm not a huge fan of rule 63, for example, but I'll still read it, particularly if I like the author-- but nothing that outright makes me cringe
( ... )
Re: What goes in the kinkmeme...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 02:19:09 UTC
I came across that earlier discussion too, and so far I've taken it that way and enjoyed the fics that came out of the looseness, but I began to wonder if I was making an incorrect assumption.
Maybe I focussed on squick in that initial post too much. I think there's been some disagreement a couple of weeks or so back about whether a character would be suitable for such and such a kink (sorry to be so vague, can't remember precisely now and I'm neither prompter nor prompt commentator, just an observer), and I wonder about what that suggests about where people's individual limits are--not so much what is shocking, but about what is ooc. There's also political things going on--e.g. recent pms discussion. I don't see these discussions as negative, because the debate is interesting, but it does suggest some type of boundary we have--not in a 'don't you dare prompt/write that' way, more in a 'I won't read that, myself' way.
Re: What goes in the kinkmeme...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 04:19:54 UTC
The prompt you're referring to was a dark!Dan one a couple of pages back. I did find the debate very interesting for the reasons you described: exactly how far is too far for some people
( ... )
So I heard you like crossovers...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 02:01:44 UTC
Have anons discovered new books/shows or gotten into other fandoms thanks to threads about them on the KM?
Personally, I discovered A Very Potter Musical from a thread waaaaaaaaay back, which I am indebted to anon to forever, because the soundtrack to that play never fails to fill me with glee. It'd be interesting to see if crossover threads only attract those already familiar with the 'verse, or if others have been drawn into those universes via the prompt.
Also-- do anons like crossover fics, or do they prefer things to be strictly Watchmen-verse? (AUs included)
Re: So I heard you like crossovers...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 03:47:34 UTC
I read Neuromancer and The Hound of the Baskervilles solely because of this meme. I stopped reading the Neuromancer crossover one or two parts in because I felt I wasn't getting it not having read the source material, then read the book and went back to read the fic again. Hound of the Baskervilles was entirely the fault of the handful of fics that said Walter was a fan XD
I generally skim crossovers. If I get what's going on I'll read it even though I know a lot of the connections/jokes/crossover bits will going over my head. If there's too many characters or too much terminology I don't know I'll skip it.
Re: So I heard you like crossovers...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 03:59:41 UTC
I like crossovers. Just like all other fics they should be self-contained and enjoyable in their own right. I'm always on the lookout for new material so if a crossover gets me into something new all the better.
So far the only new thing I've found from the KM has been the clingfilm stories, which are beautiful and amazing. But I do need to check out those books HS anon is always going on about...
Re: So I heard you like crossovers...
anonymous
February 27 2010, 06:02:55 UTC
Oh gosh, I'm the anon who posted the clingfilm request. I'm so glad you enjoyed them, I've been madly in love with them for years, ever since I found them by idly Googling the word "clingfilm" one day in 2004. Little did I know that it would turn out to be the best mindless act of boredom I'd ever perform. (And the fact that my request got filled...I love it.)
A few prompts have apologized for prompting more Dan/Rorschach, and I too feel guilty for fairly consistently prompting or filling this pairing. So I'm wondering, are people aggravated that Dan/Ror is dominating the kinkmeme, or is this all in my head?
I really hope people aren't holding back on prompting other pairings because it's a not a super popular one or one they never think'll get filled. I love that all different pairings and genres of fic are mixed together on the meme.
I don't read Dan/Ror anymore because--and this happens to me in any fandom I've been in long enough-- I've had my fill of them. But I'm not aggravated that people request them. I just counter with requests/fills for OzyCom. :D
Like you said, there are so many other pairings that if you get sick of one, there's plenty of others waiting for you.
Dan/Rorschach is kind of getting old for me. I still read it all the time, but I don't get as excited about it as I used to, and seeing strings of prompts in a row for that pairing kind of makes me go "man, another one?"
I'm not surprised about its popularity, it's what a lot of people want to see. And now that I'm looking back through recent updates, it's a pretty good balance between pairings and genres. So maybe it's partly in my head, haha.
Not getting old for me. People should always prompt and fill what they want; if the pairing involves at least one Watchmen character then it has every right to be here. Getting pissed because something you don't personally like pops up is super entitled. Just scroll on by or better yet, try it you might like it. I'm of the green eggs and ham school of reading fanfic, I am I am.
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My gut reaction is no. While some fantastic stories come out of the meme, it's often true that what gets submitted here isn't the polished version that may appear on someone's LJ at a later date, and things that could be pointed out here may already be known to the author, who was going to fix it in post anyway.
My other reason for a no is the whole idea that fills are basically gift fic, and it's never polite to comment on a gift. But at the same time, I think it's safe to say that most KMers enjoy writing and want to improve their skill. To that end, would constructive criticism, even on a gift fic, still be offensive?
I'd like to hear others thoughts on this.
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Personally I love concrit more than squee-filled comments because it gives me a chance to defend and/or reflect upon my writing and shows me that the reader really has read and does care about what she's read. It's really flattering that someone would take the time to craft together a response that is more than just a squee.
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So, writer anons...Ask for concrit and you shall receive.
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That being said, I'm always kinda shaky on how my own writing is perceived, so next time I make a post I may add a "concrit welcome" note to see what people say!
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I never had much interest in rule 63 before, but once I got into this fandom it became quite interesting and appealing. Wanda in particular is a mind-bogglingly interesting character.
I'm also happy about the amount of het and femmeslash that rule 63 generates, in many fandoms it seems girls get completely ignored, or that the het/femmeslash fics aren't very interesting.
I also enjoy the fanon names for our 63'd characters, haha.
(captcha is '1975 inspires'...oh dear)
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As for prompts that squick me: my years in anime fandoms have pretty much desensitized me to even the most obscene spectacles the mind can conjure. There are certainly prompts I don't prefer-- I'm not a huge fan of rule 63, for example, but I'll still read it, particularly if I like the author-- but nothing that outright makes me cringe ( ... )
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Maybe I focussed on squick in that initial post too much. I think there's been some disagreement a couple of weeks or so back about whether a character would be suitable for such and such a kink (sorry to be so vague, can't remember precisely now and I'm neither prompter nor prompt commentator, just an observer), and I wonder about what that suggests about where people's individual limits are--not so much what is shocking, but about what is ooc. There's also political things going on--e.g. recent pms discussion. I don't see these discussions as negative, because the debate is interesting, but it does suggest some type of boundary we have--not in a 'don't you dare prompt/write that' way, more in a 'I won't read that, myself' way.
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Personally, I discovered A Very Potter Musical from a thread waaaaaaaaay back, which I am indebted to anon to forever, because the soundtrack to that play never fails to fill me with glee. It'd be interesting to see if crossover threads only attract those already familiar with the 'verse, or if others have been drawn into those universes via the prompt.
Also-- do anons like crossover fics, or do they prefer things to be strictly Watchmen-verse? (AUs included)
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I generally skim crossovers. If I get what's going on I'll read it even though I know a lot of the connections/jokes/crossover bits will going over my head. If there's too many characters or too much terminology I don't know I'll skip it.
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So far the only new thing I've found from the KM has been the clingfilm stories, which are beautiful and amazing. But I do need to check out those books HS anon is always going on about...
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I really hope people aren't holding back on prompting other pairings because it's a not a super popular one or one they never think'll get filled. I love that all different pairings and genres of fic are mixed together on the meme.
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Like you said, there are so many other pairings that if you get sick of one, there's plenty of others waiting for you.
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I'm not surprised about its popularity, it's what a lot of people want to see. And now that I'm looking back through recent updates, it's a pretty good balance between pairings and genres. So maybe it's partly in my head, haha.
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