Personal Correspondence #12, Part 3:
4) Which leads us to the concept of atonement.
SOS: Something that does not happen in your series. Ever.
BB: (Meyer) I'm just going to mention atonement so that my readers will think I actually care about it! Bring on the sociopaths!
Question: what things can truly be made up for?
SOS: Anything at all, provided that a) you acknowledge you did something wrong, b) you feel sorry for it, and c) YOU TRY TO MAKE IT BETTER.
BB: A lot of things. Like, oh, after much angst and fighting on my part, I managed to earn my friends' forgiveness and actually checked myself into a hospital to help recover.
SOS: It's not that we're refusing to forgive murder on any grounds, Meyer. I love Hyde!Edward, and he went on a little killing spree. The difference is that he legitimately felt sorry for what he did and tried to do what's RIGHT, and ended up getting his spine broken THREE TIMES by his boyfriend (and his only companion at the time). And he STILL insisted on doing what's right, in order to atone. And most of all, he never forgave himself
BB: Hum. Reminds me of Lecter, once more, from Hannibal Rising. He killed several Nazis and a butcher in order to avenge his sister and avenge what he thought was his lover (his aunt at the time). ....Difference? NO ONE FORGAVE HIM! Lecter never forgave himself because he did no wrong in his own eyes.
LEARN THE DIFFERENCE!
If you steal a candy bar, that’s easy. You can give it back or pay for it. If you repeat a malicious rumor, that’s harder. You can retract all you want, but there is damage done to someone’s reputation that can’t fully be made right.
SOS: That doesn't mean you get away with not trying at all. That doesn't mean you can sit around and LAUGH about how you ruined that person's reputation. You TRY your damned hardest to make it better, while also trying your DAMNED hardest to not do the same thing in the future.
BB: ....Alright, I'm doing this again, simply because Meyer is making me feel angry.
Meyer? As a kid, I used to nick things from stores. Y'know why? 'Cause, to me, it was fun. I would steal cards, candy, anything. My friends TAUGHT me how to be a better thief. But guess what I felt bad for it. I didn't WANT to steal these things. And I felt EXTREMELY bad for it when someone I know got FIRED from their job because my friends stole something under their watch. After that, I made it a priority to never steal again, to report people who stole, and to try to make up for the things I STOLE. I did this by paying extra money at certain stores, or buying extra things I didn't need, just to try to atone. I apologized to managers after publicly telling them what I'd done. I helped my friend get a new job and she FORGAVE ME! AND I STILL FEEL BAD FOR IT BECAUSE I HURT PEOPLE AND I DIDN'T MEAN TO OR EVEN WANT TO! I'm STILL trying to make up for it, even today.
So shut your cake-hole, you worm.
SOS: I LOVE YOU SO MUCH. You should know that.
BB: I love you, too. I hate this steaming pile of manure, though.
If you run a stop sign and kill a pedestrian, is there ANYTHING about the situation that can be made right?
SOS: Again, just because you can't perform resurrections, doesn't mean you can sit around and LAUGH about what you did. Doesn't mean you draw inspiration from what you did when you next decide to run someone down. Which is what Edward did.
BB: You can apologize to the family. You can take driver's courses to make sure it doesn't happen again. You can work hard to try and FORGIVE yourself for it.
Maybe, if that person was the breadwinner, and you had the means, you could stop your action from causing physical want to hurt the family further.
SOS: ......Meyer. Paying your victims is not a very good way to atone. In most cases, they would just be insulted.
BB: In other cases? They would spit at you because you're just trying to get out of actually being SORRY. For actually APOLOGIZING. FOR BEING HUMAN.
But besides that? You can’t give the person back to their family. You can’t take away their grief with your own. There is a hole you’ve created that cannot be filled, no matter what you do.
SOS: But you can TRY. There is no fucking excuse to NOT EVEN TRY.
BB: No, there is not. There is never an excuse for not trying. To not try for something like this? Proves you are psychopathic and, in the least, LAZY. So, again, STFU, Meyer.
To a good person, that knowledge will cause a great deal of pain and remorse.
SOS: Which, I notice, Edward does not feel. HELLO?
BB: Meyer, this is common sense speaking. Y U NO C WHUT RITE N FRUNT U?
Does this pain help the victim’s family?
BB: YES. IT HELPS THEM KNOW YOU'RE TRULY SORRY AND WANT TO ATONE AND MAKE THINGS RIGHT! YOU ARE NOT A MONSTER!
SOS: Yes, if they can see that you are sorry, then they would feel better than if they see you laughing and planning your next vehicular homicide using their family's death as inspiration.
Not to mention, if you feel pain and remose, that could motivate you towards helping the family. Which, by definition, WOULD HELP THE FAMILY.
BB: I don't think even SAM can make me happy now.
SOS: D: Oh noes!
BB: I'll turn to the next thing on my list. -Grabs Samifer fics- I'm set.
I doubt that the family will ever feel any pain is equal to the situation.
SOS: Which means it's okay if you feel no remorse at all?
Of course it will probably hurt them if the killer feels nothing at all, but either way, remorse it outside of the situation. It doesn’t affect the hole at all.
SOS: It is SCARY how you have NO IDEA how remorse, or even grief, works at all. Seriously, there is no way this woman can be human.
BB: ...Again, my friend forgave me because I apologized and was remorseful.
And no, I don't think she is. I'd say she's a demon, but I don't want to insult Crowley. Or Crossroads Demons. Or any kind of Demon, actually. They may be fucking evil, but they don't deserve to be lumped in with HER.
Do the Cullens feel bad when, let’s say Emmett, accidentally kills that person who sets a fire in his throat, the “singers” in his past
SOS: .........Did you just imply it was the singer's fault that she got eaten? That she TEMPTED Emmett into it? That SHE was responsible for how her blood smelled?
BB: Yes, she did. Because she was Human Bacon and it's all her fault. Can you say victim blaming?
SOS: Add in the fact that biting is a metaphor for sex...Yeah, NO.
BB: This is yet another of Meyer's twisted thoughts. If a woman "tempts" a man into raping her? All the woman's fault. She was just so deliciously bacony, after all! It's no one else's fault! And Emmett, in this situation, gets off with just a "don't do it again." And that's it.
......I do not even have to go into how messed up that is. It sporks itself.
(“singers” is a relative term by the way. They range from mildly more appealing to five alarm fires)?
SOS: All so that she can make Bella even MORE speshul, even amongst Bacon People.
BB: ....I want to drag down another point. Meyer, you said your vampires did not drink for pleasure. So why the hell do "singers" even exist? There should be no reason for it. Blood should all be the same to them at this point in time.
And that's from your own mouth as well. So, once more, everyone? READ BETWEEN THE DAMN LINES! Or I will take this Colt and hit you in the head so hard with it, you'll go back to see its creator!
Of course they do. They mourn what they’ve done.
BB: ....Oh? Show us, then.
SOS: They also sit around and joke about it, because oh, they were just such DELIGHTFUL scamps.
They recommit to their cause. They do better in the future.
BB: SHOW US THIS, THEN.
SOS: Each and every single one of the Cullens slipped up more than a couple of times.
Your argument is invalid.
The family of the victim never sees them or knows of their involvement.
SOS: And thus gets no closure. Ever. They'll never know who killed their family member. Hell, in some cases, they wouldn't even know that family member is dead. They'd just wait until the end of the life, despairing, and yet still unable to let go of that one little silver of hope.
BB: No, instead they keep going on, wondering how their loved one was torn from them. Some of them will waste years of their lives - or their whole lives - trying to bring a murderer to justice. Children will never know parents. Siblings will never know their brothers or sisters. Grandparents will never see their grandbabies or their own children alive again.
Yes, I can see how this is SOOOOOOOO much better, can't you?
If the Cullens wallow (and they have), does that make one thing better or worse for the mourners? Answer: it has no effect on their pain either way.
SOS: But it makes them more acceptable characters to the readers. Again, I point to The Darkest Hour. Edward killed people there, and he couldn't have made it better if he tried. But when he realised what he did, he had a complete nervous breakdown, and we saw how distraught he was. We could believe that he was genuinely remorseful.
And what's more, the next time he heard a vampire about to hunt down an innocent girl, he put his own life in danger to save her, and was almost killed because of it. Something that your Cullens have never done and will never do. No, instead, they lend cars to people-eating vampires, allowing them to wreck more tragedy everywhere.
BB: Our author, ladies and gentlemen.
In regards to the appropriate mourning time for a guilty party:
SOS: APPROPRIATE? Lady, any time you are NOT feeling guilty for murder is inappropriate. Edward in The Darkest Hour STILL hadn't forgiven himself by the time The Blue Hour happens! That's part of why we can forgive him, because he beats himself up so badly!
BB: And it's done correctly, not you're "OH! I AM SO EVIL! BUT I AM TORN! I LOVE HER! I'LL KILL HER! ...ah, who cares, I can fuck her!" kind of "mourning." I doubt you even know what the word mourning means, Meyer.
Let’s say you’re a sixteen year old human. What’s your earliest clear memory?
SOS: Well, I'm 18, but I guess it's close enough. My earliest memory is definitely that one time I got crushed beneath 6 people on a slide, from when I was one and a half years old. It was a very traumatic experience, so I remembered it.
Personally, I have two flashes from when I was two. A couple from three. One I’m sure I was five in… Not even twenty four hour’s worth of memories from anything before I was ten, probably.
SOS: You know why that is? Because as a child, the brain is not yet fully developed. Not to mention, the brain is VERY disorganised, so most of the time, people don't remember what happened at a particular time a week ago.
However, big events, TRAUMATIC events stand out. And if I ever committed murder, you can bet I'd remember that, no matter how many 16 years had passed.
The fact that the Cullen's memories are apparently faded? that just tells me they don't care. That for them, it was Tuesday. And that is NOT a quality that should be in HEROES.
BB: It's a good quality in villains, though. Gives them things to speech about while they're telling the actual heroes their entire plan for world domination.
So my measure of time at sixteen would really be about six years of time experience. When I say, “forever” or “for the rest of my life,” my only basis for time comprehension is actually just six years.
SOS: Just because you don't clearly remember something, doesn't mean it's not a part of your experience I can't remembering learning to talk, but I can talk, and it's clearly a part of my life. I don't clearly remembering learning English, and that was only nine years ago! But clearly, that's a part of my life experience too. I can’t remember learning to walk, but that doesn’t mean it’s not a part of my life.
BB: Hell, I don't remember a good majority of my life. I barely remember when I was seven, and my life before age thirteen is pretty blurry. I don't remember learning Spanish, but I can speak it with some fluency. I BARELY remember learning French because I started that at age four, yet I can still understand my friend when she calls me from New Orleans and starts speaking in it. So this is pointless.
I can imagine multiples of that time, but the actuality of twenty years together or fifty years together is beyond me.
SOS: Meyer? Some things don't fade, and guilt from MASS MURDER is one of them. You don't get to joke and laugh about mass-murder because you did it so long ago. EVER. Not in a hundred years. Not in a thousand. Not EVER.
BB: And if you do? You're fucking sick in the head.
Right now at thirty-something, I’d guess I have almost twenty years of time comprehension. Still, not so much.
SOS: Bitch, PLEASE. Twenty-year-olds are FAR more mature than you. SIX-year-old are far more mature than you.
BB: My second cousin is more mature than her, and he isn't even a year old!
Also, don't you just LOVE how she's making sure, even now, not to say how old she really is? Doesn't want the reminder she's not a foreverteen!
Vampires have perfect recall and centuries of time comprehension.
SOS: Which means they should STILL BE IN THE DEPTH OF MOURNING NOW, because the trauma and horror is still fresh!
BB: ....-Tilts head- ......SOS. Read that. .....then think about this: Meyer says that vampires forget their human life......but they have perfect recall. So they should remember everything from their human life, no matter how trivial, and they should remember that humans are not food, that they are NOT the highest thing on the food chain, and that they CAN DIE.
...and this is out of her own mouth, once again. And she DOESN"T SEE IT.
Your “for the rest of my life” is their six years or twenty years of sorrow.
SOS: That sentence makes no sense. For the rest of their life means for the rest of their life, whether it is a hundred years, two hundred, or ten thousand. Just because they live longer, doesn't mean they get a cut-off line where it's okay to joke about mass-murder or contemplate genocide.
BB: ....SOS, she was talking about humans and their "for the rest of [my] life." Her sparklepires only think of that as six years or so.
Basically she said "You see, humans mourn for so long! My vampires just get over it later on!" while still trying to convince us they mourn for far, far longer.
SOS: If you EVER stop feeling guilty for murder, it is WRONG. I don't care how long ago it was, you should still fucking feel bad for it. Because you took someone's LIFE.
BB: Meyer doesn't care. ....I bet if she ever committed a murder, she'd laugh and say "It doesn't MATTER." And she would be convicted and sentenced to death. But I doubt she'd care.
SOS: Nah, she'd care, alright. It'd be so UNFAIR! She had a RIGHT to kill those people, dammit, because she was a bestselling author! That makes her BETTER than them! How DARE anyone convict her?
BB: Oh, I can tell her that using Meyer logic. "Because we're jurors who love our family and humanity, like your vampires supposedly do, so we're Better Than You." -Bows- And I did that all with Meyer's own twisted form of logic. Thank you.
You really can’t wallow forever. The sky is still blue. Flowers are still pretty. Music still makes your fingers tap. You can hold onto a measure of regret for forever, but grief ebbs.
BB: Yes, it does, after you feel remorse and after you ALLOW YOURSELF TO ACTUALLY GRIEVE!
SOS: And they DON'T regret it. Because you know what people who regret things do? They try to make sure they don't do it again! They don't joke about what they did! And they most CERTAINLY don't fantasise about it!
BB: ....you know something? .....I have that creeping feeling Meyer is insulting people who have depression.
SOS: *Re-reads* ...Crap. You're right.
BB: ....-Puts down the Colt- I'm afraid this job is much too big for this one gun. -Reaches into the fandom void and yanks out two giant axes- We'll try these on for size.
Back to the fire. If you knew that by putting out the fire on your hand you would be killing someone else, would you really be able to think clearly enough while burning to stop yourself?
SOS: But your vampires have a choice where they can put out the fire AND not kill anyone.
ANIMAL BLOOD.
You said in canon that it sustains them PERFECTLY.
BB: She's dropped all pretences here and is telling us the truth: she doesn't care about the animal blood any more than the Cullens really do. They all want the human blood and we all know it.
Could you burn for a stranger?
BB: Honestly? YES. People have done it before. Some people have that as their JOB. Firemen, anyone?
Meyer? Argument INVALID.
Maybe. We all want to believe that we’d be able to be that strong. But it’s hard to know what we would be capable of if our hand actually was in flames.
SOS: Your vampires do not have a choice of burning, or killing people to put out the fire. They have a choice of killing ANIMALS or killing HUMANS. And the vast majority of them choose the latter.
BB: And they choose it simply for pleasure.
No analogy can ever justify that. Ever.
5) Materialism and atoning. Wrong assumption: The Cullens are materialistic.
SOS: Meyer? What book did you think you wrote? Because it was NOT the one I read.
BB: *Right assumption. I fixed that for you.
Oh, wait, you were serious? .....What did YOU see when you wrote this shit?
Correct statement: The Cullens understand human nature well and act to protect their family to the best of their ability.
SOS: At the expense of other people. While being unnecessarily condescending and obnoxious.
BB: Correct Statement: The Cullens do NOT understand human nature at all and act to make sure people know something mysterious is going on with them, all so they can justify murder later on if someone figures out what they really are.
Here’s a little bit of human nature
BB: Don't write about what you don't understand.
SOS: Why do I have a feeling that what she says is going to be horribly insulting?
BB: -Points at his rage about her comment on Anorexia- That's why.
(this is very general, of course):
SOS: Oh yay. Because that's what we need in this letter. MORE generalisations.
BB: I'm going to need Sam, aren't I?
Who am I kidding? I know I will. -Clings to Sam-
If someone is strange to us and they are poor, they are crazy; we eye them suspiciously.
BB: …
...
......
Meyer, if someone is crazy, whether they are rich OR poor, I think they're crazy! Especially if they do crazy shit!
And stop talking down to the poor.
SOS: Have you seen the number of charity organisations around, Meyer? Have you seen all the awareness raised and aid collected for poor people everywhere? Have you seen how every government has a welfare budget that they don’t usually cut, because people get pissed about that?
This isn't human nature. This is you being a stuck-up bitch. And I won't apologise for that. SHE SAID IT HERSELF.
BB: Don't apologize. She IS a stuck-up bitch. One who makes generalizations without thinking about the pain she's causing.
In earlier times, we burned them as witches.
SOS: Something that almost EVERYONE considers WRONG now. Something that we'd NEVER do now.
BB: I want to make a point here, if you don't mind, SOS?
I'm going to go with one of the most well-known "Witch Trials" in history: the Salem ones.
Most of the supposed "witches" were actually the WEALTHIEST people in town.
They were accused because convicted witches? Were forced to give up all their worldly possessions to the people they were "attacking."
So, this tells us that we should do what, precisely? Burn Meyer at the stake because she has more money than some of us? That's what I'm getting here.
If someone is strange to us and they are wealthy, they are eccentric. We allow them to do as they will without negative judgment
BB: No. One of my best friends is richer than I will ever be. He gave me a Harley as a birthday present because he knows I like bikes and I can't afford one on my own, and he told me he was doing this. He's strange. And you bet that if he murdered someone, I’d judge him for it.
SOS: Hey, Meyer, I came from a VERY wealthy family (at least, in comparison to the poverty around us. And I don’t get away with doing socially unacceptable things. My mom gets angry at me for being weird. My classmates were never on the best of terms with me. I get shunned if I don’t censor what I say around people.
BB: Oh, SOS, don't you see? Meyer doesn't care. She doesn't give a damn about either of us, or our problems. Because it's all. About. Her.
because they must be superior to us in someway if they have been so successful.
SOS: *Jaw drops*
*Gawps*
BB: ....Did....
.......she just.....
.................she did, didn't she.
She just called herself superior to everyone else.
SOS: Yes.
She just said rich people are superior. Because their richness makes them Better Than You.
.........
I am so, so, SO sorry. I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY, I'M SORRY!
Oh GOD, that was horrible.
BB: Yes, it was. And now, as should be done, I shall pick this to pieces.
Meyer? Being rich does not make you better than me. It does not make you better than SOS. It does not make you better than your next-door neighbor. Your attitude is what makes you either better or worse.
And right now? You are a SLUG on the face of the Earth. You are NOTHING in comparison to ANYONE. Because if you think that you, the person who insults the poor, the person who insults people recovering from serious disorders, are superior?
You have something seriously wrong with your brain. I recommend therapy, more therapy, and a padded cell in a local asylum. Because I'm pretty sure that's all that could help you. Now let's go on before I try to jump through my computer screen and bash her face in with my rifle.
SOS: If I EVER sound like I think I'm better than you, PLEASE, for the love of GOD, bitchslap some sense into me.
Kings and dukes and lords got away with thousands of things that would have meant execution for a peasant.
BB: I want everyone's attention for a moment. Because I'm about to bring up someone a lot of people should know.
Countess Elizabeth Bathory, aka the "Blood Countess." She was rich. She was well-educated. She had connections to royal families through her bloodline and through marriage.
She also murdered countless girls and was imprisoned in a room to live out the rest of her life in complete solitary confinement. She died of starvation, at least, from what I remember.
Meyer? Your point? It's invalid. And I hate you. ...just thought I'd remind you.
SOS: And hey, logically, nobelmen would be MORE likely to be killed than peasants, because not only can they get busted for breaking laws (and they WILL get busted for breaking laws, because they have POLITICAL RIVALS who are waiting to pounce on their every false move), and they might get outright assassinated. Whereas peasants don't tend to have expensive hits ordered on them, usually.
BB: Once again, a Did Not Do The Research.
Celebrities today are not prosecuted for offenses with an equal punishment as an average person.
SOS: They don't?
BB: ....uh.
Let's see: Lindsay Lohan got arrested for drunk driving and served time in jail.
Winona Ryder tried to steal thousands of dollars worth of clothes from a Saks store and was given probation - the usual penalty for such a crime. (I received it as well after my crime spree.)
SOS: In fact, it seems to me that they are punished more, because their crimes are reported in a lot of media, which means the stigma follows them a lot more than a random person. Their careers will suffer because of it, sometimes they never recover, AND they get mocked and made into memes on the internet.
The only way I can think of how that statement works is that they can maybe afford better lawyers.
BB: ....-Tilts head- Why do I get the feeling she's attacking Michael Jackson here? It might just be me, but there's that feeling.
Like it or not, this is the reality of how humans in general judge others by their success.
SOS: Please don't judge humanity by yourself. That is very insulting.
BB: Especially considering we're very certain you have no humanity.
The Cullens know how this works. They know that they can exist much more invisibly by being wealthy than they could if they tried to live on the same economic level as the humans around them.
BB: ..............HAHAHAHAHAHA.
SOS: Because it is SO inconspicuous to drive flashy cars and throw money around and live in as much attention as possible. That's the best way to live INVISIBLY, alright.
And playing around with the stock market and possibly causing people to lose all their money is definitely a completely moral move, too.
BB: -Is still laughing because Meyer basically just said that her being rich means she knows all about humanity-
They’ve tested the theory.
BB: No, they haven't. There's no mention of it, ever.
SOS: And as soon as they got their hands on Alice, they immediately started using their power. Not to mention, as humbly as they live, Alice will still be into high-end fashion, and Rosalie still wants expensive cars.
Do they enjoy aspects of materialism? Some of them.
SOS: ONE. Give me ONE Cullen that doesn't flaunt their wealth, and I include Bella in that statement. ONE.
BB: I'm sorry, your answer could not be found.
They really do like speed
SOS: --and LSD.
BB: And ecstasy, a few H trains, and loooooooooots of downers, in Wardo's case.
(but keep in mind that an inexpensive bullet bike can outrace any sports car).
SOS: Um...thank you for the info? Why did we need to know that?
BB: Because she wants us to know that, yes, Edward has a huge cock. Because that's a reference to the bike he bought in Eclipse.
SOS: And as a result just admitted that the Cullens DON'T buy cars for the speed, because she said herself that INEXPENSIVE bikes are faster than their fancy cars. She ADMITTED that they're just doing it for conspicuous consumption.
Alice has a love affair with fashion, but that’s a direct result of her having no human experience to relate to.
SOS: FASHION, is not a human experience. Case in point: Alice isn't human, and she can still dabble in fashion.
Human experiences are going to sleep after a warm glass of milk. Human experiences are going out tanning on the beach. Human experiences are eating ice cream with your friends. HUMAN experiences are BEING HUMAN.
BB: Human experiences are taking a punch to the face. Or icing off your muscles with a buddy after a long run. Or, in a personal case, popping open a bottle of wine and laughing when you spill it on your best friend's head for his birthday.
SOS: Or, hell, bursting into tears at a sad movie. Sweating on a hot summer's day. Blushing when you see someone you crush on...
BB: Smiling at a good book. Screaming when the monster shows up in a horror movie. Asking someone to come over after you have a nightmare because you want to know that it's all right and you don't have to be scared.
THESE THINGS are human experiences.
Esme much prefers a broken down death trap to a brand new mansion-she likes to improve things.
SOS: And often times, it costs much more to repair and refurnish a house than just to buy one new. Your point?
BB: Oh, she has one. She wants to remind us that poor is bad. And all poor people leave behind are broken down death traps.
Carlisle likes to have access to expensive medical technologies for obvious reasons.
SOS: To fuel his morphine addiction? He doesn't NEED medical technology in his house. He has access to them at work, for whatever he needs.
BB: To prove he, too, has a dick?
Do they wrap themselves in luxuries and feel nothing for the murders in their pasts? Of course not.
SOS: You could've fooled me.
BB: You sure? From what I've read, that's all they do.
Well, that and try to prove they're Better Than Everyone.
Since when do riches equal an absence of remorse?
SOS: *Pointed look at Meyer* Gee. I don't know.
BB: Maybe you could tell us. You seem to have a very good grasp on that. After all, you think that people could just pay their way out of remorse.
However, that’s beside the point. They live wealthy because it protects them.
BB: -Fixes Meyer's words- They live wealthy lives because it shows them off and gives me things to wank to.
SOS: Yes, they do it because it benefits THEM. They don't care about the people who lost their money on the stock market because of their meddling. They don't think about their victims.
They flaunt their wealth, because it benefits THEM. In the end, it's all about THEM. And what makes THEM feel good.
6) Why aren’t the Cullens out playing Batman to redeem themselves from their sins?
SOS: Because they're selfish jerks and will only sully The Dark Knight's good name?
BB: ....Leave the Caped Crusader alone, Meyer. He's about to have enough problems when we PPC that annoying fic with him.
Is that their job?
SOS: It's not Batman's "job" to go around saving people from criminals. He doesn't get paid, and in fact has to spend ridiculous amounts of money out of his own pocket to do it.
He doesn't do it because he HAS to. He does it because it's RIGHT. He does it to prevent the tragedy that occurred to him to happen to anyone else. He does it to have Epic Shiptease with the Joker.
It's not an obligation. It's a CHOICE.
BB: Precisely. And he was HUNTED for it. So stop using him as an analogy.You're getting dirt on his boots.
If you run a stoplight and kill someone, aside from feeling bad as a natural result and doing what you can for his or her family,
SOS: Which, in just the last section of this letter, you DISCOURAGED. Because hey, it's not like you can make the situation COMPLETELY okay again, so why bother trying?
BB: Let's say it together, everyone! -Raises hands and sings- HYPOCRITE~!
is it then your job to walk the streets at night saving others?
BB: Again, it isn't Batman's job. It's his CHOICE.
SOS: When you know people are out there suffering, and you have the power and resources to stop that suffering or at least alleviate it, is it right to sit on your ass and do NOTHING?
Does that make any difference to your victim?
SOS: Yes, it does. Because that shows them that you've really atoned and are out there, trying to make a difference. That his death wasn't in vain, but what inspired you to help other people and prevent tragedy for numerous families.
And again, I have to point out that no, we can't expect the average person to devote his life to stopping crime, because there's only so much he can do, and that expectation would be unrealistic and unfair. But the Cullens are super-strong, super-fast, have almost limitless resources, and don't need to ever rest. They have everything they need to fight crime and prevent tragedy...and yet they do nothing with that power, except what would benefit themselves.
With great power comes great responsibility. We don't accept the average man to take up the responsibility of stopping traffic accidents single-handedly, but when you have as much power as the Cullens, yes, we DO expect you to use that power for good. And not just for your own, personal good.
BB: Precisely. Comparing the Cullens to Batman? Meyer, two words: Bitch, PLEASE.
What is the responsibility of the wrongdoer?
SOS: The fact that your Cullens are murderers only strengthen the fact that we want them to atone for their crimes by trying to make things better. But even if they HAVEN'T committed any crimes, we'd still be peeved that they're doing NOTHING with their power.
Spiderman would not have been a great hero if after he got his power, he proceeded to...do nothing with it. Even when he knew supervillains around and are wrecking havoc. That would make him look like a douchebag. Kind of like how your Cullens look like douchebags.
BB: PLEASE think about what you're fucking WRITING, Meyer.....-Drinks soda to cool his anger-
If you commit a lesser sin (like mean gossip from before), do you have to make that up by telling positive stories about people until the fault is redeemed?
SOS: Um, yes. I do expect you to go around and tell as many people as possible that the mean gossip wasn't true I do expect you to try and save that person's reputation.
BB: Otherwise, you're just being a stuck-up bitch.
Do this nice stories make any difference to the person you slandered?
SOS: Yes, Meyer, IT DOES.
BB: They help build up a reputation again! They help make someone FEEL BETTER!
It’s an interesting idea,
SOS: Meyer, that is NOT an interesting idea. It is what is socially required.
BB: It's what people expect.
SOS: If you talk shit about someone, you make up for it by NOT TALKING SHIT ABOUT THAT PERSON. If you make a mistake, you TRY AND MAKE UP FOR IT.This is what atonement is DEFINED as, you MORON. It’s not some unique idea of yours! This is what is NORMALLY DONE BY THE AVERAGE PERSON.
BB: SOS, she thinks what Wardo did is atonement. She has no idea what the word means.
but the rules are pretty subjective.
SOS: Meyer, people don't atone because they're regulated by RULES. People don't do it because they fear punishment. People do it because they feel bad about something and genuinely want to make it BETTER.
BB: Again, I bring up my past life as a thief, and my little jaunt that got my friend in trouble.
I searched for HOURS every day trying to help her find a new job after she was fired. I felt horrible for costing her what I did, even after she forgave me. I wanted to try to make her HAPPY again and to FIX WHAT I BROKE.
YOUR VAMPIRES DO NONE OF THIS AND THEY NEVER WILL BECAUSE THEY ARE SOCIOPATHS.
How long do you have to work off your debt?
BB: It's not a debt.
SOS: Until people look at you and say that they honestly can't ask you to do anymore. Until you've done everything someone can think of to require in exchange for forgiveness.
Again, I point you to Hyde!Edward.
Sure, he can never bring back his victims. But he cut all his ties with his only companion, run into a burning building (with fire being one of the few things that cna kill him) to save an innocent girl, got beat up with a gurney, and then exiled himself from society to make sure he didn't hurt anyone again. And when his siblings made the same mistake as he did, he did his best to help them recover and ease them back into feeding on animals.
By the end of His Brother's Keeper, I honestly can't think of ANYTHING else I want him to do in order to atone. He's literally done EVERYTHING in his power to make up for what he did.
Did he manage to completely reverse his crime? Fuck no. But he honestly tried EVERYTHING in his power.
BB: And for that, we applaud him.
Who decides that? Who is collecting on that debt?
BB: ..........THE PEOPLE. THE FAMILIES! THE BROTHERS, THE SISTERS, THE CHILDREN, THE PARENTS!
SOS: Or, in the Cullen's case, THE READERS.
How can any human situation be measured against a different human situation since we are all infinitely individualized?
SOS: Meyer, there are some standards that don't change no matter who you are and what your circumstances are. And one of them is committing mass-murder, and then joking about it. That is ALWAYS wrong, no matter HOW much of an ~*~individual~*~ you are. And your Cullens do NOT get to be automatically forgiven because they're speshul snowflakes
BB: If anything? Because they're so powerful, they should be loathed even more. Because they had this power, the ABILITY to make plenty of things right, and they just sat there with their thumbs up their asses and, in the case of a majority of them, had sex and stared at each other and were all OUR LOVE IS SO PUUUUUUUUUUUUURE!!!!!!!!!!! (YES, I am looking at BELLA AND WARDO, MEYER.)
I don’t want to get into my own belief system too much,
SOS: If your belief system says that mass-murder is okay, then it's wrong. I'm sorry, but that's all there is to it. Any religion or personal philosophy that gives someone a free-pass on MURDER is just simply WRONG.
BB: I agree.
but I think how we each view redemption really affects the answers to all these questions of atonement,
SOS: Look, I know NOTHING about the Mormon concept of atonement, but I'm pretty sure joking about it and taking inspiration from it is NOT what they consider repentance.
BB: ...Um........this might just be me reading too far into things.......but does anyone else get that feeling that Meyer is telling us our thoughts of redemption and atonement are WRONG because they are not HER thoughts?
SOS: ...Yes, it is. Since this whole letter is written to tell us why we're wrong for blaming the Cullens for committing murder.
BB: .....Meyer? Screw you with a blender put on Liquify.
and is central to the conversation (a conversation which is, at heart, quite religious in nature).
SOS: Um, excuse me? Did you just say atonement is a solely religious concept? That atonement as a thing doesn't exist to atheists?
BB: Or Agnostics?
SOS: Meyer, STOP TALKING. Really. You're bashing yourself more efficiently than any anti on EARTH.
BB: You know she won't. She thinks she's on a roll and we're all about to feel so bad for attacking her pwecious widdle Cullens.
Personally? I've never felt more justified in it.
SOS: And I've never felt so justified hating on a real person either.
BB: I know how you feel. -Glares- I remember the anorexic comment, Meyer. I am NOT AMUSED.
So I will just say that, personally, I don’t believe that I can atone for my wrong doings by myself. I believe that without a savior to atone for me, I could not be redeemed from my sins.
SOS: .......Okay, I'm going to preface this by saying that I'm about to say some probably religious offensive things. Because Meyer brought up religion first.
Meyer? We all know you only believe that for ONE reason. Because believing in a "saviour" who'll do all your atonement FOR you means you won't have to do any work. So you can shove all the blame and responsibility to someone else, and live blissfully concerned only with YOURSELF. So you don't have to think about what you did, or feel bad about anything, because that is just annoying.
Because Meyer? Lots of religions have the concept of a "saviour", like Christianity. And those religions still emphasise that the believers have to take the first step in atonement. One of the key steps of the Sacrament of Reconciliation is that you have to go out and TRY TO MAKE THINGS BETTER, because you are truly forgiven.
Jesus didn't sacrifice himself so that ALL sin is wiped from humanity, but just the original sin, so people can start from a clean slate, and their actions still decide whether they are accepted into heaven or not.
But you don't want to believe that, do you?
Because that requires you to think about your actions and how it might affect others. Because that implies you MIGHT not get to go to heaven. Because that means you have to face consequences and WORK.
No, you just want to sit on your ass and wait for someone to come along and clean up the mess you made FOR YOU.
Look, I REALLY don't want to insult anyone's personal beliefs...but Meyer? You said it yourself.
You pointed out that you don't want to atone for your crimes, unless it's by making an easy payment to the victim's family. You pointed out that even if you had the power to stop suffering and tragedy, you wouldn't do it because it's not your job. You won't get paid for it.
And now you're saying that you refuse to atone for your own misdeeds, because you believe someone else will come along and absolve you of any responsibility.
My god, I probably just made the most offensive speech on earth, but...DAMMIT, MEYER, SEE THE THINGS YOU MAKE ME DO?
I am SO sorry, guys.
BB: You're forgiven, SOS. We know this was meant to make a point.
Meyer, however, is not forgiven. Because she basically said all you said and more....and made it ten times worse than anything else I've ever seen.
So I suppose that this view point effects very much how I consider the idea of going out and racking up good deeds to offset the bad.
SOS: Namely, you don't believe in it. Because that's work, and you don't want to work, dammit. You just want to lounge around all day and wait for people to do you work FOR you.
It doesn’t work that way in my head.
SOS: Because your head doesn't work.
I am so, SO, SO SORRY.
BB: No problem, SOS. But look at what she said. .....she just agreed with you on every bad point you made about her.
SOS: I just...God, I probably sound like an ass but...I'm not religious at all, and I am being SO offended by this woman. It's to the point where I cringe on behalf of Mormons, because...my GOD.
BB: Hey. I'm not religious, either, and I'M offended on behalf of everyone because of this.
For me, the process is more like this:
SOS: Make tasteless jokes about it, fantasise about it once in a while, and otherwise completely forget about it.
BB: Unless it's to wangst.
remorse,
SOS: Which your Cullens do not feel, as evidenced by Midnight Sun.
BB: And which you have said does not NEED to be felt, because you can simply pay your way out of it.
as much recompense to the sufferer in my misdeed as is possible,
SOS: Which your Cullens did not do.
Speaking of, here's that paying off your victims thing again! Because god knows it was so nice the first time she mentioned it!
BB: =_= .....I swear, I didn't read ahead when I brought that up once more.
a sincere commitment to not behave that way in the future,
SOS: Which your Cullens do not make, as evidenced by Edward's fantasies in Midnight Sun.
BB: Which you've said means nothing because nothing you do can make up for it....
and the rest is up to God’s mercy and forgiveness.
SOS: And considering that your Cullens fulfil NONE of your PERSONAL CRITERIA for atonement? Suffice it to say that all of them will BURN in hell.
Again, Meyer, I'm using your PERSONAL CRITERIA to judge these guys. I'm using the guidelines that YOU set out. And they don't fulfil a single one.
BB: They are the weakest link. Goodbye.
I certainly didn’t think of that in regards to the idea of the Cullens playing superheroes.
SOS: Because trying to make sure the same thing don't happen to other families does not count as recompensation to the victim's families at all. After all, the only way to make up for a misdeed is through monetary means. Any other way is useless and futile.
BB: ....SOS.......Meyer just agreed with us. The Cullens are pretty much worthless as any types of heroes...and she just said "Yep, that's true!"
SOS: I have a feeling she's more saying that the Cullens are too good to be superheroes.
BB: If she says that, I'm going to attack her with the Joker's knife.......which he may or may not know is missing. >.>
But this mindset is the reason why the Cullens donning capes never occurred to me.
SOS: Because you cannot grasp the concept of doing good for the sake of doing good. Why would anyone do anything if they don't personally benefit from it?
Also, Meyer, didn't you say in an interview that you BASED your Cullens on superheroes? That your love of superheroes was what drove you to write these characters? What the hell?
BB: Hypocrite.
Because in my head, that kind of thing doesn’t earn your redemption.
SOS: See? They can't personally benefit from it, so why should they do it?
We don't ask the Cullens do go out and do good because that's how they should attempt to redeem themselves (though that's PART of the reason). We ask them to do it because they have the power and resources, and are using it for NOTHING right now.
BB: Oh, they're using it for SOMETHING, all right. Alice is using it to shop for her family's clothes and new toys! Edward is buying expensive cars!
SOS: *Grits teeth* Well, they can use that money to arrange for themselves a nice funeral, because I'm going to unleash my army of magical, flaming chainsaw-wielding hamsters on them.
BB: I have no hamsters, but I have sharks with lazer beams attatched to their heads.
Another point: the Cullens are trying very hard not to draw attention to themselves
SOS: Two words: secret identities.
Your argument is invalid.
BB: They're trying NOT to draw attention to themselves? ............And exactly how are the pricey clothes, the cars, and the mansion in the woods helping with that?
SOS: Well, it's not like they're going to INCONVENIENCE themselves for any reason! Anyway, someone else will come along and clean up their mess! Meyer said so!
BB: Meyer is an idiot.
-not because of human curiosity but because of the Volturi.
SOS: So, because of cowardice.
And because of incompetence too. It's not like Batman's activities are LEGAL, and he might very well get in trouble with the police. And yet you don't see him backing down to save his own ass.
BB: He has gotten in trouble with the police. As stated before, he was HUNTED! Hell....he was FRAMED FOR MURDER. And even ACCEPTED the blame!
They really can’t afford to be out showboating.
SOS: You don't have to "showboat" to be a superhero. In fact, most superheroes do not.
It's sad that you can't grasp the concept of people doing good not for the fame, not for redemption, not for anything personal at all, but just because they can.
BB: -Shakes head-
Does this mean they hoard their special abilities and do nothing about the people around them who might be in distress?
SOS: Yes. I point you to all the victims of the newborn army in Seattle.
No. Like any good people, the Cullens perform good deeds when the situation allows.
BB: Show me one time this happens and I'll believe everything you say. Show me one time it happens that I can't dispute in any way.
They don’t seek out dramatic opportunities, like Batman.
SOS: ...........
.......................
..............................
Meyer. You do know Batman's shtick is based on STEALTH, right?
That the point of the costume, of the training, of EVERYTHING is that he can sneak in undetected, do his thing, and then leave before anyone spots him?
You do know that he does everything in his power to NOT BE NOTICED, right?
Because here is my army of magical, flaming chainsaw-wielding hamsters. An African honey badger is the general. And they want your blood.
BB: My sharks are starving. Let them have their playtime.
But let’s say that Alice sees a vision of a car hitting a woman walking across the street in a few seconds.
BB: She'll do nothing except worry that blood will get on her pretty clothes.
She might “rudely” hustle that woman through the sidewalk like she was in a hurry.
SOS: We must never miss an opportunity to be a jackass, even when supposedly doing something good.
Also, no. We know she doesn't do that.
You know why? Because they saw 50 tourists head into the Volturi's castle in New Moon. Alice, Edward, Bella, they ALL did. And what did they do?
BB: NOTHING!
Or grab her elbow to ask her a question in the middle of the road.
SOS: Because that wouldn't put the poor woman in danger at all.
BB: ....-Sigh- Meyer's stupidity knows no bounds.
Little things that don’t look heroic, but have good results.
SOS: Which we have never seen them do in canon. Not once. All we've seen is them letting hundreds of people DIE when they have the power to stop it, simply because it wasn't their problem.
BB: Saying they "might" do it doesn't mean it happens.
Carlisle’s choice of career is based on that “good person” mentality.
SOS: Is it just me or does that sound like he's doing it as an act? That he isn't a good person at all, but is pretending to be one?
BB: Well, yeah. We all know he's in it for the drugs.
SOS: Good people don't consciously think about what a good person's mentality would be. BECAUSE THEY WOULDN’T NEED TO.
He chose a career/life work solely on the basis of where he could do the most good.
SOS: He injects morphine into people with head injuries without asking. I think he's doing more harm than good.
BB: Especially since morphine? Is addictive.
He did not choose to be a doctor out of a sense of making restitution.
SOS: If he’s not doing this as a way to atone, THEN WHY SHOULD WE COUNT THOSE ACTIONS AS ATONEMENT?
BB: -Tilts head- ....uh.......Didn't Edward say in Twilight that Carlisle chose to be a doctor to make up for his nature in hopes that he could better the world, somehow? Wouldn't that COUNT as restitution?
-Sigh- It's SAD when you use something that made no sense in books to try to make sense somewhere else.
Edward tends to see the world with more of a restitution mindset.
SOS: Which is why he contemplates which torture technique he should use when people talk to his property.
BB: Oh, of course.
That’s his individual viewpoint.
SOS: There. You just admitted that the rest of your Cullens don't feel remorse at all. Which means, again, they fail your PERSONAL CRITERIA for redemption.
BB: They fail everything. This is no different.
He’s more prone to guilt, and to a darker perspective on things in general.
SOS: Simply wallowing in wangst does not bring redemption Meyer. He never does ANYTHING as a result of his guilt. He's still going to burn in hell.
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