What is it that they say about curiousity?

[sleepysaj]

There is an interesting article on CNN.com today about homosexual orientation. Apparently the majority of Americans now believe that sexual orientation cannot be changed. At the same time, however, only 39 percent believe that people are born gay, while 42 percent believe that homosexuality results from upbringing/environment

Comments

[cynmoon]

I'm going to be the odd person out on marriage, but hear me out. It's not that I'm against gay marriage, or any marriage. I'm against the fact that all couples, who want to show their commitment to each other before their family, friends and their government are forced to go through what it an almost entirely religious practice

[sleepysaj]

I agree with you in principle. But, at the same time that very sane idea isn't gonna happen anytime soon. And, while the churches are certainly to blame for a lot of the lobbying against gay marriage, for the most part they understand that they aren't ever going to be forced to perform these marriages just as they are not forced to marry those who don't meet the tenets of their particular religion now.

The problem is the people. It's the "idea" that marriage is a God given thing. For some reason, they seem to believe that even courthouse weddings performed by a justice of the peace are somehow blessed by God.

Rather than change the entire legal system, and come up with an entirely new set of definitions, it's just simpler to keep calling married people "married" and hammer home the reality that not all marriages take place in a church.

But, if I ever get elected king of the universe, your idea will be one of the first I implement. That, and a separate island for people who leave their left turn signal on. :)

[cynmoon]

I just think it's crazy that it's okay for me to get married when I deny the fact that there could even possibly be a god (or gods), but someday I'll have to get married if I'm going to want all the legal rights it affords me.

However it's not okay from somebody who believes the whole "God loves them and made them in His image" thing to be married simply because they love someone of the same sex.

It boggles the mind.

But, if I ever get elected king of the universe, your idea will be one of the first I implement. That, and a separate island for people who leave their left turn signal on. :)

When is that election coming up, anyway? I hear it's a close race between you and Oprah. :-P

[furrykef]

I think sexual orientations can shift over time, though not necessarily in the direction you want them to. Also, I think some people have more flexibility than others... it's kind of like being right-handed, left-handed, or ambidextrous. Some left-handed people simply cannot use their right hand as if it were their left. Others can fake it: they prefer the left hand, but don't have much problem with using their right. And some are truly ambidextrous... some ambidextrous people use whichever hand they feel like using at the moment, and some just stick with one hand anyway. Muddling the matter further is that it's possible to have a sexual relationship with somebody who is outside your sexual orientation. I consider myself straight in the sense that I'm normally turned on by women and not by men, but I get emotional feelings for guys, too. For reasons like this, I rather dislike the whole idea of a "straight/bi/gay" spectrum. It's too simplistic. But, at the same time, I suppose it's necessary. Sometimes you can't win

[cynmoon]

As for the question of marriage, for a while now I've felt that marriage should be abolished from the law entirely. It would be legal to have a marriage, but marriages would no longer be recognized by the state; you'd need to get a civil union for it to be recognized. You can get married without having a civil union, and vice versa. I think it's a very elegant solution, which of course means it will never happen. People don't like elegant solutions; they like solutions that match their own point of view and nobody else's. :/

This was more or less the point I was trying to make. Forget what I said, and pretend I said something more concise, like this.

[sleepysaj]

Thanks for chiming in!

Muddling the matter further is that it's possible to have a sexual relationship with somebody who is outside your sexual orientation. I consider myself straight in the sense that I'm normally turned on by women and not by men, but I get emotional feelings for guys, too. For reasons like this, I rather dislike the whole idea of a "straight/bi/gay" spectrum. It's too simplistic. But, at the same time, I suppose it's necessary. Sometimes you can't win.

I agree wholeheartedly, but people do like to put things in boxes and catagories...etc. To tie it back, the person isn't "changing" their orientation, but instead simply may have an orientation that doesn't exactly fit any of the predefined boxes.

I think it's a very elegant solution, which of course means it will never happen. People don't like elegant solutions; they like solutions that match their own point of view and nobody else's. :/

Agreed - that was my response to Cyn. It's a nice idea, but I doubt we'll ever see it come to pass. :)

I see no reason why

[sleepysaj]

So... I think in a way orientation is sort of grey, maybe?

I agree. And, I don't think it's healthy to have only certain catagories to choose from. But, as I said ^up there^, people like boxes and catagories to describe stuff and they usually default to their majority inclination to define themselves.

At the same time, I think whatever blend a person is, that's what they are and no amount of "boot camp" is going to change that blend. The concept that a person can be counseled or shocked or medicated...whatever the methodology of the day may be...into changing their personal sexual orientation is simply incomprehensible to me.

[sleepysaj]

I answered in Yes and No, even though I do think there is a sliding scale if you will, of peoples sexual preferences.

Agreed - There's straight, there's gay, and then there's the whole grey world of bisexuality. I think the gist is that while a person may have a preference set that doesn't fit into a conventional definition, i.e. totally straight or totally gay, that doesn't mean that someone else can come in and "turn" them totally straight, or totally gay, or whatever it is that they aren't through some kind of therapy or ministry or what have you. I suppose you could talk some bisexuals into sticking with one side or the other for a while, but aside from that...no.

I'll admit to being confused, but if you love, you love and why should I have to define why I fell for someone who was married, and why should you have to define why you fell for a woman? And have a child by a man? And yet, still love a woman?Yes. Moreover, why should it matter to anyone else? How in the world could anyone else's relationship affect me or mine