Is it even possible to appropriate from a white subculture?

[chaosphaere]

This is in response to some claims I've seen - that the white mainstream is appropriating from geek culture, that metrosexuals are appropriating the markers of gay culture. I'll comment/edit with specific examples as I find them

Comments

[alias_sqbr]

GSM people may not be an ethnic minority but they're still an oppressed minority, so it seems to me that roughly similar (if not identical) issues with power and representation could come up with appropriation, or something like it.

Geeks not so much.

(Also, neither of those are exclusively white subcultures)

[chaosphaere]

What is "GSM"? Google has not been my friend.

[subcutia]

gender/sexual minorities. "LGBT" but... more inclusive.

[chaosphaere]

Thanks!

[copinggoggles]

Hm. I can see why the mainstreaming of geek culture would feel like appropriation; for a lot of its members, it's a very personal badge of self-identification, and seeing it commodified in such a way can indeed be both frustrating and even hurtful. But while geek culture is made up of individuals who, for varying reasons,* are often cast as being outside the social 'norm', geeks as a class? Yeah, not so much an oppressed minority.

*Some of which do intersect with real-world structures of oppression (e.g. disability), and some of which do not (e.g. high levels of particular types of intelligence, plain old poor social skills).

[crushdmb]

Soooooo, geeks and gay people are only white? Really?

Yeah. No.

[chaosphaere]

Definitely not, and my bad, I should've been clearer on this. The subcultures themselves though seem to have their own "mainstream" and those seem kind of based on white culture... I've known some non-white gays and geeks who felt out of place within the "mainstream" of geek and gay culture.

[copinggoggles]

I think it's fair to say that in the media/the popular imagination, both geek culture and gay culture are drawn as:

1) primarily the domain of white people, and

2) usually, but not as overwhelmingly, about dudes.

In geek culture, at least, a lot of its members are also guilty of buying into this attitude; certainly, the fact that in both subcultures the experiences of PoC have often been rendered invisible has been a source of tension in the past. In that sense, I suppose, you could call geek and gay cultures white cultures in the same way that Western society in general is a white culture - in that regardless of actual makeup, the 'default' face and POV are usually assumed by the white majority to be that of a white person.

I don't know if this is the sense in which the OP meant it, though; tbh it does sound a little like zie is asking, 'is it possible to appropriate from white people?', which... see above.

ETA: Damn, I am slow.

[chaosphaere]

Damn, that is spot on. I just didn't have the words/couldn't articulate it.

Thank you.

[papertigers]

1.) neither geek culture nor gay culture is "White."

2.) gay culture is an oppressed minority culture, and like all oppressed minority cultures it is subject to (mis)appropriation.

3.) similarly, while geek culture is a minority, it's isn't an oppressed or discriminated against minority, so (mis)appropriation doesn't really apply.

[teaberryblue]

People have already pointed out that neither gay people nor geeks are exclusively "white" groups.

But I just want to point something out. Appropriation is not in and of itself an implicitly negative term. A person can appropriate from anywhere. You can appropriate from an artistic movement, or a musical genre, or even a specific person. Appropriation only becomes an issue when the act of appropriation is damaging to a person or group.

So, of course someone can appropriate from geek culture. The better question is whether it carries the same weight or is as damaging as appropriating from an oppressed culture. Which it absolutely does not.