But also, wow, this is a good analysis and I agree with everything, because I hadn't quite thought of it like that myself (mostly because I'm avoiding thinking at all, I'm tired of papers, so fandom is the Mind Free Zone as of now); but you're absolutely right about the alternate and often conflicting, bur also equally valid moral structures that TVD presents. And Elena's speech was absolutely wonderful in that context, because it doesn't assume an absolute, overarching morality. She likes these people not because they're objectively 'good' or that 'vampires who show humanity are like humans and deserve to live', but because SHE likes them. I think that's just v. interesting and always what I felt, so the show validating that made me happy.
BONNIE WAS FLAWLESS THROUGHOUT AND SEEMS TO GETTING A MAJOR PART IN THE NEXT EPISODE AS WELL, SO, YAY.
Elena's speech was absolutely wonderful in that context, because it doesn't assume an absolute, overarching morality. She likes these people not because they're objectively 'good' or that 'vampires who show humanity are like humans and deserve to live', but because SHE likes them. I think that's just v. interesting and always what I felt, so the show validating that made me happy.
Totally. I feel like TVD is at its best when it recognizes that everyone is just the worst, but they're the worst in varying and character-consistent ways. It's really, really not about role models.
Damon being a tool about Tyler is (a) hilarious and (b) makes sense given the last season finale?
Huh. You know, I'd completely forgotten about that. Maybe because all the characters seem to have? To some extent, though, I think it comes down to Elena>>>>>>everyone except Stefan, so it wouldn't really matter WHO Klaus had sired, because protecting Elena is more important. (And of course it's all one big parallel to S2 with Damon being willing to be the bad guy because everyone already thought of him as the bad guy.) It's probably easier because it's Tyler and he's the one Damon cares about the least (except maybe Matt), but if it were Caroline or Bonnie or even Jeremy who had to die, I think Damon's only qualm would be that he knows it would hurt Elena to lose them.
I don't know if Stefan offering to leave with Klaus again was a fake-out in the way Tyler pretending to be sired still was a fake-out.You know, I don't think he was. Stefan is just enough of a drama queen to see it as fitting - last time he left with Klaus to save Damon
( ... )
Yeah, this episode was much more on form. HOW MUCH DID YOU LOVE THAT CRAY-CRAY SONG PLAYING OVER RIC DRAGGING CARO ACROSS THE PARKING LOT?
Damon being a tool about Tyler is (a) hilarious and (b) makes sense given the last season finale? Maybe that's why everyone puts the discomfort about the Klaus-Tyler dilemma on him, because he really does have a reason to act the way he does.
… Huh. I never even considered this angle. I just figured it's Damon's "I protect my own" mentality (that EVERYONE SHARES but only Damon consistently owns) that makes him a perfect scapegoat.
It is a huge disappointment that the show so far has been dropping the ball on relationship abuse, because it continues to show an astounding understanding of familial abuse.
Ugh, THIS. The Klaus-Stefan and Klaus-Tyler business was PERFECT. HOW IS THIS SHOW SO EXCELLENT IN SOME AREAS AND COMPLETE FAIL IN OTHERS???
Elena has for the first time clarified her stance about the vampires - they should all die but I don't want them to so oh well - and I think that's
( ... )
I just figured it's Damon's "I protect my own" mentality (that EVERYONE SHARES but only Damon consistently owns) that makes him a perfect scapegoat.
I agree that's totally reason enough. But I think it might've been easier for everyone to sell themselves on Damon being the baddie about Tyler because he probably has been on enough about Tyler for understandable reasons.
Yes to all your Ric thoughts too. Possession ick aside, I'm starting to think this arc is one of the few things this season has done right. He really does make a compelling villain.
Yeah, if the season had legitimately bothered to try to sell that he'd chosen it, rather than the retroactive victim-blaming, it would be an excellent character arc. As it is, that's too big a hurdle to let me get excited about it. I'm kind of hoping his new Original-ness and link to Elena mean he's going to end up daggered rather than dead-dead.
A-FUCKING-MEN. I really hope all this noise about Elena's ~choice is just trolling. Given how much this show loves epic!plot!, I can't believe
( ... )
I adored Klaus ripping the Gilbert home apart and throwing around his flaming posts in a temper tantrum. Hilarious as a viewer, but it's all about reminding us what a force for malevolent chaos he can be.
So much yes. First of all, LOL FOREVER. But also, Klaus, you are a terror, and a determined little brat too. You know he would have gotten in eventually.
good for Bonnie for knowing that but still dealing enough to help save Caroline and put down Ric.
This is the best part of the Abby/Bonnie storyline. Bonnie is not glossing over her issues with her mother. But she's rising above them as much as she can, because Bonnie will always prioritize her friends over her own emotional well-being.
Both of them, I think, weren't quite sure what power Klaus still had over them at the beginning of the episode, and it was only when push came to shove and they were forced into crisis decision-making that they got their bearings to act the way they wanted to act.
Ooooh, I really like this.
TVD's general secularism and amorality is generally
( ... )
That, or burned it to the ground, with or without the Salvatores in it. And would probably tell Jeremy how he did them a FAVOR because now they don't have to go through the crap in their attic.
This is the best part of the Abby/Bonnie storyline. Bonnie is not glossing over her issues with her mother. But she's rising above them as much as she can, because Bonnie will always prioritize her friends over her own emotional well-being.
Yeah. I just really love Bonnie for understanding that her hurt feelings are not more important than other people's lives.
Comments 8
But also, wow, this is a good analysis and I agree with everything, because I hadn't quite thought of it like that myself (mostly because I'm avoiding thinking at all, I'm tired of papers, so fandom is the Mind Free Zone as of now); but you're absolutely right about the alternate and often conflicting, bur also equally valid moral structures that TVD presents. And Elena's speech was absolutely wonderful in that context, because it doesn't assume an absolute, overarching morality. She likes these people not because they're objectively 'good' or that 'vampires who show humanity are like humans and deserve to live', but because SHE likes them. I think that's just v. interesting and always what I felt, so the show validating that made me happy.
BONNIE WAS FLAWLESS THROUGHOUT AND SEEMS TO GETTING A MAJOR PART IN THE NEXT EPISODE AS WELL, SO, YAY.
Reply
Elena's speech was absolutely wonderful in that context, because it doesn't assume an absolute, overarching morality. She likes these people not because they're objectively 'good' or that 'vampires who show humanity are like humans and deserve to live', but because SHE likes them. I think that's just v. interesting and always what I felt, so the show validating that made me happy.
Totally. I feel like TVD is at its best when it recognizes that everyone is just the worst, but they're the worst in varying and character-consistent ways. It's really, really not about role models.
BONNIE YAY.
Reply
Huh. You know, I'd completely forgotten about that. Maybe because all the characters seem to have? To some extent, though, I think it comes down to Elena>>>>>>everyone except Stefan, so it wouldn't really matter WHO Klaus had sired, because protecting Elena is more important. (And of course it's all one big parallel to S2 with Damon being willing to be the bad guy because everyone already thought of him as the bad guy.) It's probably easier because it's Tyler and he's the one Damon cares about the least (except maybe Matt), but if it were Caroline or Bonnie or even Jeremy who had to die, I think Damon's only qualm would be that he knows it would hurt Elena to lose them.
I don't know if Stefan offering to leave with Klaus again was a fake-out in the way Tyler pretending to be sired still was a fake-out.You know, I don't think he was. Stefan is just enough of a drama queen to see it as fitting - last time he left with Klaus to save Damon ( ... )
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HE HAS TO GO OUT AND GET A MINIVAN
Reply
Damon being a tool about Tyler is (a) hilarious and (b) makes sense given the last season finale? Maybe that's why everyone puts the discomfort about the Klaus-Tyler dilemma on him, because he really does have a reason to act the way he does.
… Huh. I never even considered this angle. I just figured it's Damon's "I protect my own" mentality (that EVERYONE SHARES but only Damon consistently owns) that makes him a perfect scapegoat.
It is a huge disappointment that the show so far has been dropping the ball on relationship abuse, because it continues to show an astounding understanding of familial abuse.
Ugh, THIS. The Klaus-Stefan and Klaus-Tyler business was PERFECT. HOW IS THIS SHOW SO EXCELLENT IN SOME AREAS AND COMPLETE FAIL IN OTHERS???
Elena has for the first time clarified her stance about the vampires - they should all die but I don't want them to so oh well - and I think that's ( ... )
Reply
I agree that's totally reason enough. But I think it might've been easier for everyone to sell themselves on Damon being the baddie about Tyler because he probably has been on enough about Tyler for understandable reasons.
Yes to all your Ric thoughts too. Possession ick aside, I'm starting to think this arc is one of the few things this season has done right. He really does make a compelling villain.
Yeah, if the season had legitimately bothered to try to sell that he'd chosen it, rather than the retroactive victim-blaming, it would be an excellent character arc. As it is, that's too big a hurdle to let me get excited about it. I'm kind of hoping his new Original-ness and link to Elena mean he's going to end up daggered rather than dead-dead.
A-FUCKING-MEN. I really hope all this noise about Elena's ~choice is just trolling. Given how much this show loves epic!plot!, I can't believe ( ... )
Reply
So much yes. First of all, LOL FOREVER. But also, Klaus, you are a terror, and a determined little brat too. You know he would have gotten in eventually.
good for Bonnie for knowing that but still dealing enough to help save Caroline and put down Ric.
This is the best part of the Abby/Bonnie storyline. Bonnie is not glossing over her issues with her mother. But she's rising above them as much as she can, because Bonnie will always prioritize her friends over her own emotional well-being.
Both of them, I think, weren't quite sure what power Klaus still had over them at the beginning of the episode, and it was only when push came to shove and they were forced into crisis decision-making that they got their bearings to act the way they wanted to act.
Ooooh, I really like this.
TVD's general secularism and amorality is generally ( ... )
Reply
That, or burned it to the ground, with or without the Salvatores in it. And would probably tell Jeremy how he did them a FAVOR because now they don't have to go through the crap in their attic.
This is the best part of the Abby/Bonnie storyline. Bonnie is not glossing over her issues with her mother. But she's rising above them as much as she can, because Bonnie will always prioritize her friends over her own emotional well-being.
Yeah. I just really love Bonnie for understanding that her hurt feelings are not more important than other people's lives.
Reply
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