(Untitled)

Oct 21, 2013 17:37

I am definitely interested in the proofs anyone here can offer regarding the existence of self-aware intellects other than my own.

Leave a comment

Comments 38

lordhellebore October 21 2013, 21:48:34 UTC
My Christmas cards to you prove that I exist.

q.e.d.

Reply

pastorlenny October 21 2013, 22:11:46 UTC
Point taken!

Reply

lordhellebore October 21 2013, 22:20:17 UTC
*annoyingly smug grin*

Reply


fieryphoenix October 21 2013, 21:59:00 UTC
Proofs of this sort are usually either eloquent and simple or mind-numbingly complex. Neither knowing the likelihood of each nor knowing how to even begin to determine it, I can only operate on the assumption that it's a 50/50 shot. The short and simple route by definition limits the effort necessary to a very manageable sum, while the complex one might not even contain an upper bound. Assuming a random length between a bit longer than the short proof and infinity, we can assume the median likely length is half of infinity, which for all intents and purposes is still infinity. The most prudent route, then, is to affirm that I am a self-aware intellect, and that this is so because it has been said by a self-aware intellect, and subsequently challenge the ground on which anyone could credibly question said statement by questioning the veracity of their own self-aware intellect.

"Because I solipsistically said so!"

Reply

pastorlenny October 21 2013, 22:12:48 UTC
Oh, I'm already convinced that I don't exist.

Reply

lafinjack October 21 2013, 22:49:57 UTC
Why should I prove I exist to someone I can't prove exists?

Reply

pastorlenny October 22 2013, 00:50:31 UTC
:)

Reply


pickleboot October 21 2013, 22:28:12 UTC
i could prove it, but that would require posting ( ... )

Reply

pastorlenny October 22 2013, 00:51:11 UTC
That's a lot of Bosch and Poppycock!

Reply

pickleboot October 22 2013, 01:16:42 UTC
it is. i have been reading way too many of my old art history text books in preparation for my shiny new job and then reading way too much speculation about how zombies could happen. it's fascinating to me. i think i know way too much about the science behind how it could happen.

but i am excited about my new job. i get to read and look at art and immerse myself in chemistry and all that. fun times. as soon as my brain is fixed.

oh- and i create, therefore i am.

Reply


meus_ovatio October 21 2013, 23:55:07 UTC
I shall remind you of the eternal philosophical argument by which identities and existence are established:

p1) If A looks like a duck, and
ps2) if A quacks like a duck,
then C) A is in fact a duck. A self-aware duck of some intellect.

Reply

pastorlenny October 22 2013, 00:49:36 UTC
Answered like a true crypto-duck.

Reply


chordatesrock October 22 2013, 00:54:37 UTC
I offer instead Pascal's wager. There are two options for any given possibly-sentient entity, and two options for your behavior, that are independent of each other, leading to two squared (=four) possibilities:
There are no real other people, and you treat them as if they are nonsentient.
There are no real other people, and you treat them as if they are sentient.
There are real other people, and you treat them as if they are nonsentient.
There are real other people, and you treat them as if they are sentient.

I pick anything other than the third option. Without being able to control other people's sentience (that's called murder and would probably eventually lead to jail or, if you succeed in making sure that there are no other sentient beings around, extreme loneliness), you have only one way to avoid that scenario, and that is by acting as if other people are sentient.

Reply

pastorlenny October 22 2013, 17:59:55 UTC
"Act as if" is very useful operationally -- but not so much epistemically.

Reply

chordatesrock October 22 2013, 18:21:36 UTC
I care less about your epistemology than I do about your behavior toward other people, partly because I am included in the set "other people". Besides which, there's not much you could do with the revelation that you were alone in the universe. Other people will still not let you murder them, even if they don't actually care. I suppose you could ignore the afflicted and not spend any resources helping them.

Personally, when I wonder about being alone in the universe, and then see posts like yours not written by me, I find that I'm inclined to think they're written by sentient beings like me, but maybe I just don't remember that I'm going to go back in time to live your life when I'm done living mine.

Or try this on for size: maybe what makes us sentient is God, in us. Would that make you alone in the universe or not?

Reply

pastorlenny October 22 2013, 20:24:31 UTC
So lies are OK if they promote good behaviors?

Reply


Leave a comment

Up