Budgie with thyroid or liver disease
Our budgie Winter has been giving us quite the scare for the past few months, and today's vet visit left me with more questions than I started off with. So I figured I'd post here and get your thoughts.
A little history:
- Middle of October, bruises showed up on Winter's beak. I wasn't aware of any bangs or falls that could've caused them. More have not showed up, though. I'm not sure if this is related but, I figured I'd add it in just in case.
- Early December: I found Winter all bloody, floured him down to stop the bleeding, and rushed him to our avian vet. She said he had a cyst on his wing that he'd picked open, and she removed it. Picture of his bloody cyst-y mess is [here].
- Late December: I found him dripping with blood... one wing and his tail were just completely matted down with it. I felt like I was battering a chicken, I didn't know where the blood was coming from so I was just putting flour everywhere. Took him to the vet again. The cyst had grown back and he picked it open again, and he broke a blood feather in his tail (I don't know how). Plus his beak was overgrown. She removed the cyst, trimmed his beak, and yoinked out the offending tail feather.
Before both vet visits in December we noticed small changes in Winter. Not enough to be huge warning signs, but enough to make us keep an eye on him. He was sleeping a bit more, flying a little less, etc. He perked up after both vet visits but declined back to this afterwards. We could swear he's been eating more than usual but... he's always eaten more than the rest of the flock, so we're not sure if we're just over-reacting by thinking he's eating more than he usually does.
It's been 3 weeks since the vet trimmed his nails and beak and you wouldn't know by the pictures that I'll link in a minute. The cyst on his wing grew back in abundance and now a cyst is starting on his other wing. He picked at one and there was some blood but, not much and it dried before I saw it. Pictures: [1] [2] [3]
He went to the vet yet again today. She trimmed his beak and nails but did not remove the cysts. She said she thinks he has either liver disease or thyroid disease, but she doesn't know which. She said she can't do a test to figure out which because a budgie doesn't have enough blood to do the test with. She said he's gained weight consistently with each visit. She wants to put him on thyroxine for the rest of his life and said we'd have to separate him from the rest of the flock forever (we have 6 budgies total). [Editing to add:] The thyroxine is a pill that needs to be crushed into his water, and so he'd need to be separated to let him have his own water dish that the healthy budgies can't drink out of.
Needless to say, my husband and I are not happy. I mean, if that's what we have to do, we'll do it. But we just don't feel right jumping straight into it. She didn't mention milk thistle or lactulose or silymarin for the possibility of liver disease. I know that liver disease can be treated or even reversed, and it just doesn't feel right to me to blindly jump into the permanent-medication option without a) exploring other options or b) a definite diagnosis.
Anyway, he has an appointment with a different avian vet for a second opinion on Monday. I'll call tomorrow to have copies of his records sent over, and I'll see if I can ask the vet some questions while I'm on the phone with them anyway. In the meantime, I'm left poking around the internet. He's out and about with the flock at the moment, eating and flying and the usual - but visually uncomfortable. I feel bad for him.
What are your thoughts? What would you do if this were your budgie? Do you have any suggestions for me? And thank you for reading. :)
A little history:
- Middle of October, bruises showed up on Winter's beak. I wasn't aware of any bangs or falls that could've caused them. More have not showed up, though. I'm not sure if this is related but, I figured I'd add it in just in case.
- Early December: I found Winter all bloody, floured him down to stop the bleeding, and rushed him to our avian vet. She said he had a cyst on his wing that he'd picked open, and she removed it. Picture of his bloody cyst-y mess is [here].
![[here]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/angilla/WinterBloody.png){kind=link}
- Late December: I found him dripping with blood... one wing and his tail were just completely matted down with it. I felt like I was battering a chicken, I didn't know where the blood was coming from so I was just putting flour everywhere. Took him to the vet again. The cyst had grown back and he picked it open again, and he broke a blood feather in his tail (I don't know how). Plus his beak was overgrown. She removed the cyst, trimmed his beak, and yoinked out the offending tail feather.
Before both vet visits in December we noticed small changes in Winter. Not enough to be huge warning signs, but enough to make us keep an eye on him. He was sleeping a bit more, flying a little less, etc. He perked up after both vet visits but declined back to this afterwards. We could swear he's been eating more than usual but... he's always eaten more than the rest of the flock, so we're not sure if we're just over-reacting by thinking he's eating more than he usually does.
It's been 3 weeks since the vet trimmed his nails and beak and you wouldn't know by the pictures that I'll link in a minute. The cyst on his wing grew back in abundance and now a cyst is starting on his other wing. He picked at one and there was some blood but, not much and it dried before I saw it. Pictures: [1] [2] [3]
![[1]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/angilla/cyst_18th_zpse5fda601.png){kind=link}
![[2]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/angilla/winter_22nd_zps6db4aa34.png){kind=link}
![[3]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/angilla/winter2_22nd_zpsc2f5ee2d.png){kind=link}
He went to the vet yet again today. She trimmed his beak and nails but did not remove the cysts. She said she thinks he has either liver disease or thyroid disease, but she doesn't know which. She said she can't do a test to figure out which because a budgie doesn't have enough blood to do the test with. She said he's gained weight consistently with each visit. She wants to put him on thyroxine for the rest of his life and said we'd have to separate him from the rest of the flock forever (we have 6 budgies total). [Editing to add:] The thyroxine is a pill that needs to be crushed into his water, and so he'd need to be separated to let him have his own water dish that the healthy budgies can't drink out of.
Needless to say, my husband and I are not happy. I mean, if that's what we have to do, we'll do it. But we just don't feel right jumping straight into it. She didn't mention milk thistle or lactulose or silymarin for the possibility of liver disease. I know that liver disease can be treated or even reversed, and it just doesn't feel right to me to blindly jump into the permanent-medication option without a) exploring other options or b) a definite diagnosis.
Anyway, he has an appointment with a different avian vet for a second opinion on Monday. I'll call tomorrow to have copies of his records sent over, and I'll see if I can ask the vet some questions while I'm on the phone with them anyway. In the meantime, I'm left poking around the internet. He's out and about with the flock at the moment, eating and flying and the usual - but visually uncomfortable. I feel bad for him.
What are your thoughts? What would you do if this were your budgie? Do you have any suggestions for me? And thank you for reading. :)