Ukraine: The Haze of Propoganda

[evilnel]

From Moscow to London to New York, the Ukrainian revolution has been seen through a haze of propaganda. Russian leaders and the Russian press have insisted that Ukrainian protesters were right-wing extremists and then that their victory was a coup. Ukraine’s president, Viktor Yanukovych, used the same clichés after a visit with the Russian

Comments

[mingemonster]

Those fascists in the government are just a myth, then? But hey. As long as its not the president! Because, as we all know, in a democracy the head of state holds all the power.

This article seems to be working from the conclusion that being "popular" and being fascist are mutually exclusive. They're not. It can be a popular movement and still be a terrible development.

[evilnel]

I think you missed the point of the article. It was not saying that a popular movement can't be fascist. That's obviously not true (hello WWII Italy/Germany/etc). It was saying that the propaganda Putin is putting out is saying that this is a right wing neo-nazi takeover incited by the west which is anti-semetic and against those who are ethnically Russian/native Russian speakers. The article is saying this is patently and verifiably untrue. The leaders of the opposition are a diverse group of Ukrainians that consists of people of Arab decent, Poles, Russians, Jews, etc and while they are supporters of the west and democracy, this was a movement that came organically from the people. In fact, one of the governors who was recently appointed in the east to help keep order is a well known oligarch who is also Jewish. Rabbis have denounced this claim of persecution as well as many ethnic Russians. If you had actually read the article, you would have known that, unless you are also a propaganda mongerer, in which case, well done. Putin

[mingemonster]

Obviously not every single protester is a nazi. That's a pretty weak argument. And it doesn't change the fact that these protests have been enormously beneficial for fascism, and it doesn't change the fact that they obviously have enough support to end up in the government.

[evilnel]

The accusation is that these people are anti-Russian nazis but several of them are actually ethnically Russian and there's no evidence they're nazis. Anyway, I'm tired of engaging with propaganda trolls and idiots.

[joiedumonde]

I'm taking a lot of what I'm hearing with several grains of salt, but I want to thank the OP for this detailed overview. I was just commenting on another comm that I wanted to know what propaganda was being put out there to inflame the tensions as quickly as it seems to have done. I hate that I'm dependent on western news outlets like MSNBC, CNN, and BBC who are too busy covering the West's response and showing video of Russian troops to actually talk/show what disinformation is being spread about as justification.

[evilnel]

BBC and NPR have both been pretty good thus far. There are quite a few independent bloggers out there talking about it too, but unfortunately most of those are in Russian. Surprisingly, Forbes and WSJ have a pretty good line in because they've been following the money trail which is, I think, harder to judge than the narrative in some ways.

[makeme_moo]

Could you perhaps give me a few links to some of those independent blogs? (Especially the ones in Russian.) I am hearing a lot about Neo-Nazis killing Russians/Pro-Russians from the Russian side of my family, coupled with 'you don't understand because western media propaganda.' I would really like to have some new material to introduce to the conversation...

[bnmc2005]

Russian propaganda called it, predictably enough, the Gayeuromaidan.

Is this for real?

I find this horrifying.

[evilnel]

I just googled it and unsurprisingly, there were some articles saying this was how Russia had been referring to the demonstrations. Apparently they've even called Vitali Klitchko and his brother "gay icons" or something. ~_~

[evilnel]

(As if that should even be an issue. Just more ridiculous hate mongering.)

[apostle_of_eris]

great
I wanted to talk about the centuries of history (not least that in the experience of Ukranians, Nazi rule is far less bad than Russian rule), and the whole thread is two rival "It's all about MEEEee"s.
phooey

[mingemonster]

unlike this sparkling gem of a comment

[moonshaz]

Please, do talk to us about those centuries of history and how they play into all of this. There are people here (of which I'm one), who I'm sure would be very interested. It sounds fascinating to me!

[alexvdl]

I'll agree with that. It's super interesting to me how little stuff that happened fifty to sixty years ago can culminate in world shaking events like this one.