I wish I could sit down and quote many of the points you made, and cheer like a hooligan, and give some really thorough feedback. But I can't - and I highly doubt I would be as eloquent as you.
What you've done with this is make the case for Chlollie - I love it. Seriously, this was so enlightening to me in so many ways as someone who only started shipping these two towards the back end of season nine.
One of the things I loved most was what you said about "Hostage", and the role that Ollie played in Chloe's life in drawing her out from her hiding place, Watchtower, and into life. I think it speaks so well to the entire season as I see it, this was happening to multiple characters, on so many levels. The writers might do a lot of nonsense but I can appreciate the intricacy of that at least ;) That moment was amazing, and again, the multiple levels of Clark being there physically, but it was Oliver that helped Chloe to heal emotionally and I'm glad the writer's were explicit about that.
What's really powerful to me in this is now that you've traced it from the nascent stages, I can see it. This has nothing to do with anything but I'm a Clois fan. And reading this, reminds me of the many times I've seen Clois fans try to trace the development of that relationship from the beginning. My conclusion: is there is almost always something there if we're only willing to see it. I do think it was a little more obvious with Clois seeing as they had anvils to drop, and I felt the chemistry from the get-go, which is not a universal experience obviously but that's another story.
Back to the subject at hand, Chlollie :). I've been re-watching season 8, and I must say, that if I'd been more open at the time, I would have really seen the potential of Chlollie -- no doubt about it. Everything you said about how these two KNOW each other, have seen each other at their darkest, the absolute worst sides of themselves -- is grounded in that season for me. Just fabulous.
Chlark is an interesting relationship for me, mainly because I've always felt it was quite unhealthy on both parts in a lot of ways. I never liked that Chloe made him her whole life or let his life and secret consume her, and I never liked that Clark let her, that he sometimes took advantage of that, and that he allowed himself to rely so much on her as his crutch in so many ways. It made both of them come off poorly, imho. That's kind of why I like their respective relationships now, and why I think Ollie works so well for Chloe -- he SEES her where she was invisible to Clark; they are mutually empowering, honest and sexy -- so many things I can't list. So thank goodness for that!
There's so much more I could say, but I'll quit rambling like a fool. I just wanted to say thanks very much for taking the time to do this and for filling in every detail to this more complete picture I now have the couple; giving me things to mull on; and a new perspective.
Also, totally agree with you on the Lollie rehash (disliked that storyline so much). What always struck me about it was just how little that was about Lois, and how much it was about Oliver and the emotional/mental state he was in, I saw it as his need to reach for someone who was an embodiment of his past self. A self that he thought he needed to be in order to be a 'hero'.
It really shouldn't have gone past "Crossfire", if EVEN that -- oh, writers, why do you do these things?
Anyway, it was Chloe that helped him to realize that there was someone worth fighting for in the NOW, that underneath all the booze and depression, Oliver was still worth fighting for. And that his scars, and experience didn't make him any less worthy. I believe he did the same for her.
I'm sorry to essentially word-vomit all over your journal but your post is so great, and I can't help myself. Thank you again :)
I really really love that Chlollie saved each other this past season. I was hoping that's how it would play. As a fan of Chlark I wanted him to have something to do with that moment, so I was pleased with that, but it was definitely having Oliver in her life that made her want to come out of that dark depression of not trusting anyone.
psst *beckons you closer* I'll confess something. I recently watched Clois from the beginning to see if I could enjoy it in an unbiased way and there are parts I enjoyed. Where I previously felt like Lois just all of a sudden fell for Clark (I love him - committed) I've changed my mind. I definitely saw feelings develop way back in Crimson. What I saw was a friendship building and then feelings develop (more from Lois' side) but season eight seemed like a jump because season seven had so little clois development, whereas they had a nice flow going from 4-6, IMO. But yes, I definitely saw things different going back and watching from the beginning. I think it helps to have the whole picture.
*sigh* I agree with you somewhat on Chlark. I didn't see it has an unhealthy relationship, but I saw parts of it as unhealthy and I saw some really beautiful things in that relationship. Sometimes Clark would show that Chloe meant the world to him and at other times, like you said above, it felt like he took advantage of how far she would go for him. I do think Chloe making him her everything was unhealthy and that lead to not good things.
I do believe she can have a much healthier relationship with Oliver and it's equal. I really love how they've grown into each other (as my friend Jenna has said)
lol! please do ramble. I'm a rambler too and I enjoy a good discussion.
Yes, me too! I think that was a really good moment for balancing what Chlark means, and what Chlollie is. Like you said in your post, they copped out in the finale with Chlark, and us not seeing a scene of these two friends who've been so much to each other for all these years faced w/the possibility of never seeing each other again -- was daft. I think there's a good opportunity this season to show, even a little bit, how well their friendship can work when they're on more of an even footing like this. Hopefully, we'll see that.
LOL, couldn't agree more. I've been doing a re-watch, and so many things are way clearer, and more enjoyable now that I know where it's going and there's a little bit of distance w/that. I've been enjoying things like Lexana, for goodness sakes! Who would've thought it? I guess that's the nature of TV. And I'm glad that you see the glimmers of Clois as well :)
Thanks! You may revoke the license to ramble soon ;)
What you've done with this is make the case for Chlollie - I love it. Seriously, this was so enlightening to me in so many ways as someone who only started shipping these two towards the back end of season nine.
One of the things I loved most was what you said about "Hostage", and the role that Ollie played in Chloe's life in drawing her out from her hiding place, Watchtower, and into life. I think it speaks so well to the entire season as I see it, this was happening to multiple characters, on so many levels. The writers might do a lot of nonsense but I can appreciate the intricacy of that at least ;) That moment was amazing, and again, the multiple levels of Clark being there physically, but it was Oliver that helped Chloe to heal emotionally and I'm glad the writer's were explicit about that.
What's really powerful to me in this is now that you've traced it from the nascent stages, I can see it. This has nothing to do with anything but I'm a Clois fan. And reading this, reminds me of the many times I've seen Clois fans try to trace the development of that relationship from the beginning. My conclusion: is there is almost always something there if we're only willing to see it. I do think it was a little more obvious with Clois seeing as they had anvils to drop, and I felt the chemistry from the get-go, which is not a universal experience obviously but that's another story.
Back to the subject at hand, Chlollie :). I've been re-watching season 8, and I must say, that if I'd been more open at the time, I would have really seen the potential of Chlollie -- no doubt about it. Everything you said about how these two KNOW each other, have seen each other at their darkest, the absolute worst sides of themselves -- is grounded in that season for me. Just fabulous.
Chlark is an interesting relationship for me, mainly because I've always felt it was quite unhealthy on both parts in a lot of ways. I never liked that Chloe made him her whole life or let his life and secret consume her, and I never liked that Clark let her, that he sometimes took advantage of that, and that he allowed himself to rely so much on her as his crutch in so many ways. It made both of them come off poorly, imho. That's kind of why I like their respective relationships now, and why I think Ollie works so well for Chloe -- he SEES her where she was invisible to Clark; they are mutually empowering, honest and sexy -- so many things I can't list. So thank goodness for that!
There's so much more I could say, but I'll quit rambling like a fool. I just wanted to say thanks very much for taking the time to do this and for filling in every detail to this more complete picture I now have the couple; giving me things to mull on; and a new perspective.
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It really shouldn't have gone past "Crossfire", if EVEN that -- oh, writers, why do you do these things?
Anyway, it was Chloe that helped him to realize that there was someone worth fighting for in the NOW, that underneath all the booze and depression, Oliver was still worth fighting for. And that his scars, and experience didn't make him any less worthy. I believe he did the same for her.
I'm sorry to essentially word-vomit all over your journal but your post is so great, and I can't help myself. Thank you again :)
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psst *beckons you closer* I'll confess something. I recently watched Clois from the beginning to see if I could enjoy it in an unbiased way and there are parts I enjoyed. Where I previously felt like Lois just all of a sudden fell for Clark (I love him - committed) I've changed my mind. I definitely saw feelings develop way back in Crimson. What I saw was a friendship building and then feelings develop (more from Lois' side) but season eight seemed like a jump because season seven had so little clois development, whereas they had a nice flow going from 4-6, IMO. But yes, I definitely saw things different going back and watching from the beginning. I think it helps to have the whole picture.
*sigh* I agree with you somewhat on Chlark. I didn't see it has an unhealthy relationship, but I saw parts of it as unhealthy and I saw some really beautiful things in that relationship. Sometimes Clark would show that Chloe meant the world to him and at other times, like you said above, it felt like he took advantage of how far she would go for him. I do think Chloe making him her everything was unhealthy and that lead to not good things.
I do believe she can have a much healthier relationship with Oliver and it's equal. I really love how they've grown into each other (as my friend Jenna has said)
lol! please do ramble. I'm a rambler too and I enjoy a good discussion.
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LOL, couldn't agree more. I've been doing a re-watch, and so many things are way clearer, and more enjoyable now that I know where it's going and there's a little bit of distance w/that. I've been enjoying things like Lexana, for goodness sakes! Who would've thought it? I guess that's the nature of TV. And I'm glad that you see the glimmers of Clois as well :)
Thanks! You may revoke the license to ramble soon ;)
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