wow, this is long, sorry! Pt 2youcallitwinterFebruary 6 2012, 18:09:02 UTC
But I do think that right now the show is DEFINITELY not painting Stefan as any ‘better’ than Damon. I mean, I’ve seen a lot of people saying that and I just don’t see it. Stefan is very OBVIOUSLY the bad guy right now. I mean, the show has gone hoarse stating it, Damon flat out said that he just goes over the edge. He’s hurt Elena badly and right now he’s being a bitch, but he is paying for it. It’s not a utopic world where everyone hates Damon but they’re fine with Stefan going batshit. Stefan has pretty much lost everything worth living for. He has no friends, the girl he loves kissed his brother, his brother (whom he’s been making all these grand sacrificial gestures for) basically went ahead and kissed the girl he knows Stefan loves. And it’s all Stefan’s fault, and he knows this. He knows he has no high ground right now which is why he’s being petty about it, and the show is acknowledging this.
But I also truly believe that Stefan being bad, doesn’t automatically make Damon “good”. I think the best thing about these character is that they’re pretty much not romantic heroes at all. They’ve done horrific things which it may not be very easy to atone for. It’s like thinking of Matt, should he forgive Damon-the guy who killed his sister? Does saving his life make that okay? Or his killing Lexi, his brother’s best friend. Or Stefan killing Andie, just as a casual collateral damage. Does the fact that Stefan saved Elena’s life on Wickery Bridge mean that she should forgive him for what he did to her on it just a couple episodes back? Or should Caroline forgive Damon for all his abuse and compulsion and basically using her as a human blood bag (not to mention his multiple attempts to kill her) because he saved her life? I think these are all relative questions and it’s very easy to argue from both sides (like, Damon fans will always argue his case, as will Stefan fans) but the show is trying to explore both sides and I really do think that’s wonderful. This also means that Damon will never be the quintessential “good” guy because he’s done too much to too many people (and neither will Stefan now), but that’s realistic and that’s amazing. Maybe he can’t completely make up for past mistakes, but the girl he loves is attracted to him, he has friends in town, his brother basically bargained his life away for his sake which is a statement of his love, and honestly, he’s actually pretty well off according to me!
Re: wow, this is long, sorry! Pt 2mridul777February 6 2012, 20:11:06 UTC
Don't get me wrong..... I LOVE STEFAN.... I get what you're trying to say about him being petty with the Damon/Elena issue. It's because I love him, I feel sorta weird seeing him being all .. like the way he is now... he's being a hypocrite, that's why I find it a little irritating....
I understand that Stefan becoming bad doesn't make Damon good. Damon's road to goodness started well before.
You see I agree and understand all the points you made here. It's just the mindless pegging of "Damon's SOOO EEEVIIILLL he doesn't deserve ELENA" seems a little not cool to me.
What Stefa has done or is doing.. i KNOW he isn't not gonna be let off the hook for it, but I wish how his past mistakes were forgiven and not really rehashed, the same treatment was made in Damon's case as well.
I mean we and the Mystic folks saw Damon doing those bad things and Stefan's past was a narration, and that wasn't complete either so I guess until they actually SAW it with their own eyes (like they did this time) it's true implication wasn't understood.
My only problem is I wish Damon's only definition shouldn't be JUST a dick.. because he's not that. He's a dick and more.
Re: wow, this is long, sorry! Pt 2youcallitwinterFebruary 7 2012, 07:01:29 UTC
This is definitely true, he is being petty. But I think they’re deliberately playing him like that, like, he’s a jerk and the show knows this. He has no high ground to act the way he is right now, but he’s still acting childish. That doesn’t make him a very nice person, but it makes him a good character. Like, if everyone was heroic and self-sacrificing then the show would be rather boring, not to mention completely unrealistic.
I’m genuinely curious as to why you feel that Damon’s being targeted or that people think he’s ‘just a dick’? Like, I haven’t personally felt this vibe. Only last episode Elena asked Stefan if he’d been killing all those people and never ever thought of asking Damon (as Stefan pointed out), and I think that’s pretty good proof of how much their relationship and people’s perception of Damon has changed. None of the characters will even think of asking Damon if he’s been killing etc (even Caroline first thought of Tyler, not Damon) which is pretty good indication that they all trust him now.
I think they (Alaric, Bonnie, Caroline) think he’s not good enough for Elena, which is pretty understandable right? You wouldn’t want your best friend/surrogate daughter to fall for someone who has hurt her, and people she loves, in the past, no matter how good he is now. But they all understand that ultimately it’s Elena’s decision to make. This also doesn’t mean that all of them personally have issues with Damon; they may love him and trust him and still not think that he’s good enough for Elena. That’s pretty realistic. To be honest, I wouldn’t want my best friend dating a guy who had hurt her, even if he’s ‘reformed’ or something.
(Also don’t worry about the actors, they love to troll and more often than not, they have no idea what’s in the later scripts, so what Ian says isn’t what the show says and the show is the ultimate authority).
Re: wow, this is long, sorry! Pt 2mridul777February 7 2012, 12:56:32 UTC
(Also don’t worry about the actors, they love to troll and more often than not, they have no idea what’s in the later scripts, so what Ian says isn’t what the show says and the show is the ultimate authority).
See that's the ROOT of ALL my issues. There's a saying that if you repeat a lie over and over, it somehow sounds like a truth.
It isn't really wise to pay attention to everything these actors say, but sometimes what they say are important and sometimes they are just bluffing (Although I don't know if the recent interview of Daniel Gillies stating "Elijah is in Love with Elena" falls into which category!).... Some fans still believes their every word and then these half truths results in confusion at times.
I just wish they dialed their trolling down a notch.
But I also truly believe that Stefan being bad, doesn’t automatically make Damon “good”. I think the best thing about these character is that they’re pretty much not romantic heroes at all. They’ve done horrific things which it may not be very easy to atone for. It’s like thinking of Matt, should he forgive Damon-the guy who killed his sister? Does saving his life make that okay? Or his killing Lexi, his brother’s best friend. Or Stefan killing Andie, just as a casual collateral damage. Does the fact that Stefan saved Elena’s life on Wickery Bridge mean that she should forgive him for what he did to her on it just a couple episodes back? Or should Caroline forgive Damon for all his abuse and compulsion and basically using her as a human blood bag (not to mention his multiple attempts to kill her) because he saved her life? I think these are all relative questions and it’s very easy to argue from both sides (like, Damon fans will always argue his case, as will Stefan fans) but the show is trying to explore both sides and I really do think that’s wonderful. This also means that Damon will never be the quintessential “good” guy because he’s done too much to too many people (and neither will Stefan now), but that’s realistic and that’s amazing. Maybe he can’t completely make up for past mistakes, but the girl he loves is attracted to him, he has friends in town, his brother basically bargained his life away for his sake which is a statement of his love, and honestly, he’s actually pretty well off according to me!
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I understand that Stefan becoming bad doesn't make Damon good. Damon's road to goodness started well before.
You see I agree and understand all the points you made here. It's just the mindless pegging of "Damon's SOOO EEEVIIILLL he doesn't deserve ELENA" seems a little not cool to me.
What Stefa has done or is doing.. i KNOW he isn't not gonna be let off the hook for it, but I wish how his past mistakes were forgiven and not really rehashed, the same treatment was made in Damon's case as well.
I mean we and the Mystic folks saw Damon doing those bad things and Stefan's past was a narration, and that wasn't complete either so I guess until they actually SAW it with their own eyes (like they did this time) it's true implication wasn't understood.
My only problem is I wish Damon's only definition shouldn't be JUST a dick.. because he's not that. He's a dick and more.
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I’m genuinely curious as to why you feel that Damon’s being targeted or that people think he’s ‘just a dick’? Like, I haven’t personally felt this vibe. Only last episode Elena asked Stefan if he’d been killing all those people and never ever thought of asking Damon (as Stefan pointed out), and I think that’s pretty good proof of how much their relationship and people’s perception of Damon has changed. None of the characters will even think of asking Damon if he’s been killing etc (even Caroline first thought of Tyler, not Damon) which is pretty good indication that they all trust him now.
I think they (Alaric, Bonnie, Caroline) think he’s not good enough for Elena, which is pretty understandable right? You wouldn’t want your best friend/surrogate daughter to fall for someone who has hurt her, and people she loves, in the past, no matter how good he is now. But they all understand that ultimately it’s Elena’s decision to make. This also doesn’t mean that all of them personally have issues with Damon; they may love him and trust him and still not think that he’s good enough for Elena. That’s pretty realistic. To be honest, I wouldn’t want my best friend dating a guy who had hurt her, even if he’s ‘reformed’ or something.
(Also don’t worry about the actors, they love to troll and more often than not, they have no idea what’s in the later scripts, so what Ian says isn’t what the show says and the show is the ultimate authority).
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See that's the ROOT of ALL my issues. There's a saying that if you repeat a lie over and over, it somehow sounds like a truth.
It isn't really wise to pay attention to everything these actors say, but sometimes what they say are important and sometimes they are just bluffing (Although I don't know if the recent interview of Daniel Gillies stating "Elijah is in Love with Elena" falls into which category!).... Some fans still believes their every word and then these half truths results in confusion at times.
I just wish they dialed their trolling down a notch.
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So I wanted to ask, did you see the movie "Jab We Met"?
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*sigh*..now only if I had someone who could have written me a delicious D/E fanfic based on that movie.... :/
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