The Face of Boe revelation. No, no, no, no, no, noooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!! For one thing, he's supposed to be an entirely different species! For another, Jack is apparently slowly aging (one gray hair in 140 years). For another, I really hate the thought of full of life, vibrant, flirty Jack turning into a face in a jar (and what happened to the rest of his body, if he really is the FoB?) and dying, without the Doctor even realizing he'd been Captain Jack Harkness once upon a time. I cling desperately to my own fanwank that Jack was part of the police department in "New Earth"... then he couldn't be the Face of Boe (John Barrowman's voice is heard in the episode, as a police officer).
Well--with new technology and all in the next centuries, he could've been kept that way for whatever reason to stay alive. Think of...whatsherface that was always crying "motorize me" and it was a thin flap of skin? Or somehow he could've been transformed into what the FOB ending up looking like? *shrug*
That's okay, I find myself signed out sometimes and realize it when I've just replied to something... and see it comes out as anonymous.
I'm very glad you came over and replied. :) As long as I don't get a flame (and I haven't, on any entry yet, knock wood), I'm fine with people replying and I specifically sent you the PM with the direct URL so that we could continue to discuss it, if you want. :)
I'm gonna go make a cup of tea and then reply to your longer comment. *grin*
Mmm... I always took Jack's "Doctor's honour" line at face value, too, though I don't like how ambiguous it was. How did he rebuild it? If Torchwoods 2-4 were always there, and they weren't destroyed, how was he rebuilding it? Was he part of Torchwood before Torchwood One's fall? If not, what was he doing? And if not, where does he have the power or influence to rebuild it? There's a lot of issues I have with this, and I can't help feeling not all of them will be resolved and they were simply ignored so that RTD could put in a happy line to make the audience believe EVERYONE LURRRRRRVES THE DOCTOR. And it's stupid. And yes, I'm bitter, how could you tell
( ... )
How did he rebuild it? If Torchwoods 2-4 were always there, and they weren't destroyed, how was he rebuilding it? Was he part of Torchwood before Torchwood One's fall? If not, what was he doing? And if not, where does he have the power or influence to rebuild it?
I thought maybe he changed the purpose/intent of, at least, Torchwood Three. I'd love something in the series, saying that the Doctor, if he shows up, is to be treated like a respected adviser or something along those lines, and that Jack's got that for any Torchwood operations going on (2 in Glasgow, if 1 is rebuilt somewhere/somehow, 4 whenever it shows up again). I'd also like some answers to things like, how long has he known about Torchwood, when/how did he join, was it his choice or he wasn't really given one? etc., etc., etc.
There's a lot of issues I have with this, and I can't help feeling not all of them will be resolved and they were simply ignored so that RTD could put in a happy line to make the audience believe EVERYONE
( ... )
I vaguely get the feeling I've read your first few paragraphs before, but it might just be my imagination and the fact that we've discussed similar things. In any case, I'm glad you were questioning whether it was the TARDIS or the Doctor that made them go to the future at that point, because I took the Doctor's explanation at face value while, of course, the show later proved you right because the Doctor offered to take Jack along again (and they probably returned to Earth from the Valiant on the TARDIS too). And we know the TARDIS and the Doctor have a psychic link, so the TARDIS might've been reacting against Jack, but only because of the Doctor's influence
( ... )
I vaguely get the feeling I've read your first few paragraphs before, but it might just be my imagination and the fact that we've discussed similar things.
Heh, probably because we discussed similar things.
In any case, I'm glad you were questioning whether it was the TARDIS or the Doctor that made them go to the future at that point, because I took the Doctor's explanation at face value while, of course, the show later proved you right because the Doctor offered to take Jack along again (and they probably returned to Earth from the Valiant on the TARDIS too). And we know the TARDIS and the Doctor have a psychic link, so the TARDIS might've been reacting against Jack, but only because of the Doctor's influence....
Yep, in which case, another reason to dislike 10... grrrrrrrr!!!!!
"Well, Season 2 seems intent on giving us some answers, now that RTD's done with Jack in Who and stopped being a control freak about him (which, unfortunately, doesn't bode well for a Jack/Donna/Ten lovefest). In any case, I'm guessing you're right about
( ... )
I LOVE your review. And I hated the way Capt Jack was misused in the episodes as well. Honestly, the episodes felt so disjointed. You mentioned the TARDIS's supposed reaction to Jack in Utopia, yet the Doctor asks Jack to travel with him (HUH?) Jack's a fixed point in time and space and yadda yadda... yet we see the Face of Boe die? Huh? And what about the fact it was mentioned in S1 that Boe had kids? How just a human head procreate? I really had trouble liking The Doctor after his treatment of Jack in the three episodes. *sigh*
I've been wanting to smack the Doctor since DT became the Doctor. Not every second, but it certainly built up over the second series, with Rose and the Doctor becoming so wrapped up in each other and ignoring everyone else (ie., Mickey at the beginning of an episode, who was doing something for half an hour because neither could be bothered to tell him to stop after a few seconds). I was really hoping that the Doctor would get the smackdown he deserves, then have it end on a high note, with both Jack and Martha on good terms with him. *sigh* I still want to smack him, for The Episode That Never Was, for his high-handedness re: Jack's Vortex Manipulator.
I wish someone would write a really good finale to go with "Utopia" and "The Sound of Drums", that would use Jack and Martha and her family in a good way.
I'm glad I'm not the only person ho picked up on the isomorphic response reference to B7/ There was also Martha's "I'm coming back." line from the end of SoD, which is Blake's final line in _The Way Back_ as the prison ship is leaving Earth. In DT's confidential there's a brief montage of old SF programmes that flashes by very early on and one of the shots is the original federation logo, so I think the SoD/LoTTL references must be deliberate. I wonder if it's RTD who's the fan or someone else (DT may be, but obviously he's not involved in the writing so it must be someone else).
Re: B7 referencesmickeykAugust 11 2007, 04:29:33 UTC
I'm glad I'm not the only person ho picked up on the isomorphic response reference to B7
Me too!
There was also Martha's "I'm coming back." line from the end of SoD, which is Blake's final line in _The Way Back_ as the prison ship is leaving Earth.
Thanks for that reminder!
In DT's confidential there's a brief montage of old SF programmes that flashes by very early on and one of the shots is the original federation logo, so I think the SoD/LoTTL references must be deliberate. I wonder if it's RTD who's the fan or someone else (DT may be, but obviously he's not involved in the writing so it must be someone else).
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Well--with new technology and all in the next centuries, he could've been kept that way for whatever reason to stay alive. Think of...whatsherface that was always crying "motorize me" and it was a thin flap of skin? Or somehow he could've been transformed into what the FOB ending up looking like? *shrug*
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So, how are you?
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I'm very glad you came over and replied. :) As long as I don't get a flame (and I haven't, on any entry yet, knock wood), I'm fine with people replying and I specifically sent you the PM with the direct URL so that we could continue to discuss it, if you want. :)
I'm gonna go make a cup of tea and then reply to your longer comment. *grin*
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How did he rebuild it? If Torchwoods 2-4 were always there, and they weren't destroyed, how was he rebuilding it? Was he part of Torchwood before Torchwood One's fall? If not, what was he doing? And if not, where does he have the power or influence to rebuild it?
I thought maybe he changed the purpose/intent of, at least, Torchwood Three. I'd love something in the series, saying that the Doctor, if he shows up, is to be treated like a respected adviser or something along those lines, and that Jack's got that for any Torchwood operations going on (2 in Glasgow, if 1 is rebuilt somewhere/somehow, 4 whenever it shows up again). I'd also like some answers to things like, how long has he known about Torchwood, when/how did he join, was it his choice or he wasn't really given one? etc., etc., etc.
There's a lot of issues I have with this, and I can't help feeling not all of them will be resolved and they were simply ignored so that RTD could put in a happy line to make the audience believe EVERYONE ( ... )
Reply
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Heh, probably because we discussed similar things.
In any case, I'm glad you were questioning whether it was the TARDIS or the Doctor that made them go to the future at that point, because I took the Doctor's explanation at face value while, of course, the show later proved you right because the Doctor offered to take Jack along again (and they probably returned to Earth from the Valiant on the TARDIS too). And we know the TARDIS and the Doctor have a psychic link, so the TARDIS might've been reacting against Jack, but only because of the Doctor's influence....
Yep, in which case, another reason to dislike 10... grrrrrrrr!!!!!
"Well, Season 2 seems intent on giving us some answers, now that RTD's done with Jack in Who and stopped being a control freak about him (which, unfortunately, doesn't bode well for a Jack/Donna/Ten lovefest). In any case, I'm guessing you're right about ( ... )
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Honestly, the episodes felt so disjointed. You mentioned the TARDIS's supposed reaction to Jack in Utopia, yet the Doctor asks Jack to travel with him (HUH?)
Jack's a fixed point in time and space and yadda yadda... yet we see the Face of Boe die? Huh? And what about the fact it was mentioned in S1 that Boe had kids? How just a human head procreate?
I really had trouble liking The Doctor after his treatment of Jack in the three episodes. *sigh*
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I've been wanting to smack the Doctor since DT became the Doctor. Not every second, but it certainly built up over the second series, with Rose and the Doctor becoming so wrapped up in each other and ignoring everyone else (ie., Mickey at the beginning of an episode, who was doing something for half an hour because neither could be bothered to tell him to stop after a few seconds). I was really hoping that the Doctor would get the smackdown he deserves, then have it end on a high note, with both Jack and Martha on good terms with him. *sigh* I still want to smack him, for The Episode That Never Was, for his high-handedness re: Jack's Vortex Manipulator.
I wish someone would write a really good finale to go with "Utopia" and "The Sound of Drums", that would use Jack and Martha and her family in a good way.
Reply
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Me too!
There was also Martha's "I'm coming back." line from the end of SoD, which is Blake's final line in _The Way Back_ as the prison ship is leaving Earth.
Thanks for that reminder!
In DT's confidential there's a brief montage of old SF programmes that flashes by very early on and one of the shots is the original federation logo, so I think the SoD/LoTTL references must be deliberate. I wonder if it's RTD who's the fan or someone else (DT may be, but obviously he's not involved in the writing so it must be someone else).
I wonder who it is, too.
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