there's no problem ... only solutions

Apr 15, 2008 10:33

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WANT SOME CORN SQUEEZIN'S AND BRIE WITH THAT CROISSANT MY FRIEND? OR - THE AUDACITY OF HATESomeone once said that liberals weren’t stupid; it’s just that everything they believe is wrong ( Read more... )

philosophy, meditation, current events

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with all due respect metaphorsbwithu April 17 2008, 15:04:01 UTC
RE: Nothing to do with ethanol

Of course some of the anecdotal examples you mentioned apply in part, and I acknowledge the effect of local politics and weather, but if you don't think the main reason for shortages and high prices are not fuel related, you have a geranium in your cranium. ;-)

Have you noticed the price of milk, eggs, or even pop corn lately? Or corn-fed beef?

Even the radical environmental economist Jeffrey Sachs admitted as such last night on the Charlie Rose Show, although he also blamed global warming and a lack of concern by the World Food Bank and the industrialized world.

As an example he mentioned how Malawi was all but ignored by the world community (not true). Charlie Rose just accepted it. As a matter of fact, they recieved so much extra foods, it drove the prices DOWN so that local farmers were hurt badly, and they couldn't get rid of the stuff. That's what bureaucrats and central planning, even if well-intentioned, will do for you.

You can look it up.

He mentioned how Australia's (a major rice exporter) recent drought affected food shortages too, although he didn't mention that droughts in Australia are natural phenomena caused by the geographic location, ocean currents, wind patterns, etc.

You can look that up too.

The rural Chinese are tired of eating rice, btw, and they want some more protein like the city slickers. They're using some of their grains to raise chickens and pigs.

Rice production in many areas have been hampered by a lack of monsoons and flooding which provide the overwhelming source of their water supply. No flooding ... no rice farms.

Twenty percent of corn grown here is now used to make ethanol and, without subsidies, no corn farmers would be able to remain in business. That's a fact. In South America, forests are being cleared and farmers are switching to sugar production because they can sell it for more for ethanol production.

Ask anyone in the produce business here why their prices are so high.

As always, I appreciate your comments, and often enjoy your different perspective, but if you'd check all these facts, you'd find they they are absolutely true.

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Re: with all due respect goodall April 18 2008, 15:50:56 UTC
In California, the food prices have gone up either very little or not at all in the areas you have mentioned. I know, because 1. I work at a culinary school, so I get to hear about the wholesale end of the scoop, and 2. I am a regular food shopper, and have not seen the prices of beef, milk, eggs, or popcorn change at all. Produce, on the other hand, has become incredibly expensive (regular non-organic bananas--79 cents a pound out here!) if it is not local and seasonal, and of course gasoline. Pretty soon we will be at $4.00/gallon. $3.60 a gallon is seen as a good price out here.

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Re: with all due respect metaphorsbwithu April 18 2008, 16:08:20 UTC
From the AP:

... higher U.S. prices seem eye-popping after years of low inflation. Eggs cost 25 percent more in February than they did a year ago, according to the USDA. Milk and other dairy products jumped 13 percent, chicken and other poultry nearly 7 percent.

USDA economist Ephraim Leibtag explained the jumps in a recent presentation to the Food Marketing Institute, starting with the factors everyone knows about: sharply higher commodity costs for wheat, corn, soybeans and milk, plus higher energy and transportation costs.

There are sure to be local exceptions. I can tell you that eggs here, which last year could be purchased on sale for $1 a dozen and usually topped out at around $1.40-1.50 are now costing $1.89-2.19 for large eggs. Milk that sold for $3.59-3.99 is now $4.35-4.59 for generic brands, name-brands around $5.50.

Restaurants here have prices around 25% higher or more over the last couple of years and food quality in many places is down.

The overall impact is clear and its only getting worse. You are lucky to be in an area that produces lots of food for export and transportation costs may not be as great.

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Re: with all due respect goodall April 18 2008, 17:49:50 UTC
The prices for milk and eggs are always super inflated in mainstream supermarkets. Not at Trader Joes, though! I can still get eggs for $1.29, and a 1/2 gallon of milk or $1.99.

Restaurant prices have been steadily increasing for years, and often many times within a year. I no longer eat at American restaurants because of this. Restaurants, point blank, are out to make a profit--especially chain restaurants. Whatever happened to the 99 cent Whopper? Can't get one anymore, although I beat the system by ordering a sandwich and side without the drink (I bring bottled water everywhere) because the cost of a value meal is inflated due to the soda. You know how much it costs Burger King to make one regular Coke, as compared to how much they charge a customer for it? This has nothing to do with gas prices (unless the price of soda gas for carbonation has gone up.)

In other parts of the US, I know things are not good food-wise, but not out here. There is nothing that I can do about this except be grateful for my situation, I suppose.

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Re: with all due respect metaphorsbwithu April 18 2008, 18:07:13 UTC
California is lucky in that it is, I believe, the largest producer of agricultural products in the U.S. Restaurants and grocers can get produce from closer sources in larger quantities in fewer shipments. Add the irrigation subsidies to dairy farmers and illegal workers in agricultural and dairy farming, and the prices there should be lower. Of course, I'm sure the taxes more than make up for these more reasonable prices. ;-)

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Re: with all due respect goodall April 18 2008, 21:26:41 UTC
There is a great deal of state support in California for all farmers, big and small, organic or otherwise. The state encourages people to buy produce at local farmers' markets as well, and lets everyone know that food stamps are always accepted in the local farmers' markets.

If my taxes are used to support California agriculture, so be it. We are all reaping the benefits here, and nothing good ever comes for free. People who want something for nothing...well, they will get nothing. This is why the public schools here are so miserable compared to other states, but that is a whole other subject.

I would love it if a politician of any kind could bring up to the feds or the state government that it should be made a law that the IRS and the state treasury should show the honest taxpayer how their money is being spent. I know more about how the money in my 401K works than what percentage of my state/federal taxes go where. A pie chart would be most helpful, even if they put it on their website for easy access.

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