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[lissie_pissie]

Thank you so much to everyone who offered thoughts on my last post - I've been checking in on it and reading it even if I haven't responded to you yet. You guys are SO fucking helpful and smart, seriously. I decided to do number 4, discussing the treatment of women in sitcoms from three different decades. So if you have any more thoughts on that

Comments

[lissie_pissie]

I WOULD *LOVE* TO WRITE ABOUT CUDDY. But House is considered a drama, and he asked for situation comedies (to focus on the dramatization of sexual attitudes and marriage). but House is hilarious, think I could stretch it??

[sangria_lila]

Use Cuddy as a supporting point. One main element of sitcoms is snappy dialogue, which Cuddy has plenty.

[ellixian]

I haven't read your other post - just dipping in and out of my flist at work right now - but this sounds like an awesome topic. You have great choices too, for the older shows. I don't know if you've heard of The Dick Van Dyke Show though; it's one of my favourites, and also one of the most interesting when it comes to the depiction of women in TV as it transits from, say, the independent housewife era of I Love Lucy to the modern, single career girl sitcom like the Mary Tyler Moore Show (which is probably the other girl-power sitcom you might want to reference when you're doing this AWESOME project

[snapplesons]

Thank you for mentioning Murphy Brown! I had completely forgotten about her.

I hope you don't mind me butting in, but I found your post very interesting!

Now the stereotype is for a tough-minded career woman to be bossy, rude, uptight and incapable of being feminine and sweet etc when all she's focused on is her job.

I think my opinion differs slightly from yours in that I think workaholic women on television still need to be seen as sweet and cute and feminine to be liked by a general audience. (Mind you, the only women who I'm thinking of right now are the ladies from Cashmere Mafia and Lipstick Jungle.) I was hoping you could give me an example of a character that fits your stereotype. While I'm sure they exist, I'm having a hard time thinking of one. (The only that comes to mind actually is Cutthroat Bitch, but I'm not sure she counts.)

[zorabet]

The wife on Still Standing. She's not so much focued on her job, but she's very much not the usual woman figure. Her and her husband drink beer and go out and party and watch sports game and a lot of the comedy comes from her lack of compassion towards her kids.

Sorry to but in, I had just been thinking about her when I saw this post.

[snapplesons]

Yes, Judy Miller would be a good example for a non-traditional mother and housewife. I actually mentioned the Miller family to Lissie earlier when she brought up Married with Children.

My question, however, for ellixian was to give an example of a rude, bossy, tough-minded career women who was incapable of being feminine.

[a_celeste]

I don't know if you are familiar with The Cosby Show, but it's been best known for many things. And Clair Huxtable has been one of those TV woman I have always looked up too. Not only was she at the time (80's) stuck in the mold of being part of the unsuccessful black community, but she was also a woman. And The Cosby Show has one of those timeless comedies about families and stuff, and she's like a lawyer right, but she really hits the mark with also being a mother - a wife, and a woman. And she's put side-by-side with a successful, loving doctor as her husband.

Have you perhaps looked at Elaine from Seinfeld (I love this show, so lolz). I don't know how you can incorporate her, but she could be put side by side with the boys and hold her ground? She hasn't exactly settle-down, but you could consider Elaine's longest commitment to be with her boys (George, Jerry, and Kramar). I think they're all still in jail? hahaha

I don't know if that's helpful. Well, I'm on msn if you need to bounce of ideas. I'm revise a paper too. Ack.

[snapplesons]

I think even with women's liberation, women are still objectified to WANT the same things as Samantha Stevens and Lucy Ricardo wanted. With the exception of Samantha Jones on SatC, most women have the same primary goals: to get married and/or have kids. Even Miranda Hobbs wanted kids! Liz Lemon on 30 Rock expressed a desire to have children and a fear of being "too old" to do so. Also, remember the episode of Friends where Rachel turns 30 and she talks about the goals that she had? Some of her goals included getting married and having children. (And then she had to break up with Tad, because he was hindering her growth.)

It seems that nowadays women have even harder roles to fill. They have to have successful jobs and they have to want to be good, dedicated mothers. They must crave a semi-traditional family setting. To make make a bossy career women likable and accepted, she has to WANT, even to a smaller degree, to conform to social norms. (I know you can't use her on paper, but just to give you an example in case I'm not making

[sangria_lila]

On that note, check out Desperate Housewives, the first season when it was good. Lynette especially.

Also - Samantha rocks my fricking socks.

But you can't deny that many women DO want kids. It would make all evolutionary sense to want kids around your twenties/thirties. You (that being Lissie) might want to talk about how the kid-want isn't accurately portrayed (like Cuddy's is badly protrayed).

I'd also have to respectfully disagree that women's liberation has happened. Well, it has, but it's not enough. 94% of the superclass is still white males, and the rising members of are still male, albeit Asian.

[sangria_lila]

Hey, I know it's late but would Sex and the City count as situation comedy? I say that because that's the first TV show I'd think about that doesn't 'objectify' women, but you can also argue that it helps to objectify them in other ways (i.e. that all single women are obssessed with Manolos, that they are all frivolous etc