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Sep 22, 2005 21:29

WARNING: I AM NOT TRYING TO FORCE MY BELIFES ONTO YOU! YOU DONT HAVE TO BELIVE THIS! IF YOU DONT LIKE THIS THATS YOUR OPINION! DONT COMPLAIN! IF YOU ARE THINKING ABOUT REPLYING IN A NEGITIVE WAY, DONT BOTHER ( Read more... )

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 17:42:26 UTC
well not exactly on the last bit. Life isn't energy, though it uses it. What sci course(s) are you taking this year? If you've taken a chem course or a higher level Bio, you'll know about enthalpy and entropy, measures of order and chaos. The second law of thermodynamics states that even if in an open system, enthalpy is increasing, overall in the universe, entropy is increasing constantly. Combustion, being catabolic, increases entropy, but doesn't do anything to increase enthalpy , but life does. Life (at least here on earth) has genetic material, with which it reproduces. The systems of life create an island of greater enthalpy in a sea of increasing entropy, seperated by a membrane.

The other thing is, when fire reproduces, it doesn't pass on any of itself to the child fires. Basically, assuming that one fire has the energy needed to start the material for the second one, none of the original is passed on, more than that it exists. So if you light a piece of paper over an alcohol lamp or an oil lamp or a Bunsen burner, or another piece of burning paper, it is still just a burning piece of paper... Actual organisms take their trait differences from their parents.

/ramble

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knunn September 22 2005, 17:55:21 UTC
very techincal, im trying to explane an extreemly simple view, which most people miss. Life is different chemicals forming structures, which are influenced by energy, they dont use energy, they are infuenced by it. Like a lightbulb, it doesnt use energy, it is influenced by it, when electricity passes through the filament, it heats up, and give of a small amount of light, it didnt decide to use the electricity. What im trying to say, is we are exaclty the same a a computer, we react entirly to imput. Why do we reproduce? because there is a chemical reaction happening in our brains telling us to do it, that chemical reaction happened because it was influenced by an energy source. When it comes down to it, every little bit of life, came from the same parent. So technicaly, were all just cells in the body of earth. Im trying to view all of this from a compleetly unbias point of view, like say i was something, not life, that came from another dimention or whatever, and id never seen life of stars or plannets, to me, the sun would be alot more impressive than life. because what chemical reactions do we do that are as impressive as the sun, or even Earth.

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 18:08:20 UTC
true, but life (and other reactions) does use energy, just one kind. In a system with absolutely no energy gradient, nothing happens. Thats called absolute zero.

And I think protein synthesis is cooler than nuclear reactions. Yeah, the sun does have that "wow" factor, but I would think that assuming they can see things on a molecular/atomic scale, the mechanics of life are more interesting. (at least to me they are, in some ways)

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knunn September 22 2005, 18:14:50 UTC
What way does it use energy?

"(at least to me they are, in some ways)" Yes to you they are, becaues you are part of it, im saying to something that has never seen energy or matter (lets just say its something else) what would the difference be between 2 hydrogen molecules fusing into 1 helum, and one proteen breaking down into simpler proteens? if its the amount of reaction, think ot the life cycle of a large star.

And yeah we've just done the ...fun... tirtrations.

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 18:25:27 UTC
http://web.indstate.edu/thcme/mwking/protein-synthesis.html
Thats pretty cool. And synthesis is making proteins, not breaking them down.

*drip......drip.......drip...................................*

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knunn September 22 2005, 18:27:48 UTC
did i say synthesis?

*.....drip....drip....colour change....drip....drip....oh shit, start again...*

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 18:45:35 UTC
no, but I did say synthesis =)

and if you're thinking about the size of a conglomeration of reactions, then a boulder of sandstone the size of a basketball is clearly cooler than a pineapple.

and about titrations, if you go over, you can just add a ml (or whatever is enough to get it back to the original color) of the first solution, just MAKE SURE to add that into the original volume. A 5 minute fix is a whoooooole lot easier than redoing a 40 minute titration, even if you have to play around a bit with calculations later....

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knunn September 22 2005, 18:51:06 UTC
we were doing a back titration, and the teacher wouldnt let us correct it like that.

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 18:56:26 UTC
ahh well...
just wait till you get reactions that take several seconds for the color of each drop to go away (Catalase/hydrogen peroxide, eg. Enzymes are such fun........) That titration took a looooong time...

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 17:55:59 UTC
oh, and the decomposition of faeces (if we're using the latin) is life-based, as is the decomposition of a whole bunch of things. In fact, the decomposition of food in your stomach is what powers your body. Again, that catabolic reaction powers the making of ATP, the decomposition of which powers a whole bunch of anabolic reactions.
Decomposition outside the body is just a continuation of this, with unicellular organisms using your food for the same purpose you did, as an energy source.

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knunn September 22 2005, 17:57:39 UTC
get a peice of shit and burn it, i bet it will be a prety good energy source...

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 18:10:02 UTC
It is, normally herbivores that don't fully digest their food give the best fuel. Buffalo, camel, horse, elephant, etc.

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knunn September 22 2005, 18:07:28 UTC
And im taking chem and physics.

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hhgg42 September 22 2005, 18:10:35 UTC
cool, those are fun. Good luck with titrations =)

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