I'm sorry, John.

[kissingdaylight]

{ lyrics of the day }
what will it take for you to understand
this is something the doctors just can't fix?
its always been my style to live a lie
i'm out of breath and we're out of time

Comments

[newnumber6]

Yeah, there's a couple different possibilities going on with the future. Either they jumped to sometime before John Connor was famous in the future (possible, but unlikely), or, by jumping, John erased himself from the timeline up to that point (at least, until he gets back). Now, if we trust that he _is_ some kind of future messiah, this should mean that the resistance, although it may exist, is in a much direr position than it was in the original timeline. Of course it could be some kind of exercise in making him realize that he is _not_ the only hope for humanity, even if everybody's been telling him that his whole life. (Or I guess the 'John Connor' of legend could actually _be_ Young Time Travelling John Connor all along, and just nobody said it, but that might be a little too much to swallow

[kissingdaylight]

That's the thing. We don't know when exactly in the timeline Cameron was created. (I always thought it was after Kyle jumped back, but before Derek did, but we actually don't know about that first part really.) I don't know where this comes from, but I've read it in more than one place, so maybe it comes from T3 (which I haven't seen): John becomes famous after he breaks himself and a bunch of humans (including Kyle) out of a machine work camp. So it's possible that that hasn't occurred yet, but I think it's less likely than John just not being a great leader in this future (if an adult him exists there at all). And yeah, the great and powerful leader could be our 17-year-old, but if they go with that I will laugh

[newnumber6]

Yeah, you're right about John liberating a work camp being one of the big things he was famous for (though I don't know if it was the first or only thing). That coem sfrom the series and, I believe, the first movie. T3 suggested he was involved in coordinating the military from the beginning, but they're ignorign a lot of T3

[kissingdaylight]

Right, yeah, I saw part of T1 the other day and Kyle explains the work camp thing to Sarah. I'm glad I'm not just going crazy.

Well now I'm pretty sure that in canon there are different universes because I was listening carefully to what Kyle said and he said he came "from the future; well, one possible future." I understand your explanation, but it will continue to bother me a bit. Why would the machines have any different motivations than the humans? Don't they want to survive and not be killed off even more?

That's something explored in other shows, I know. That if you have the same person from two different timelines, they can't meet or else the world will fall apart and all. When they did it on Roswell, when the future had been changed significantly enough, the person from the future just disappeared because they no longer existed. I like this realm of thought.

That's okay! I mean, I think those are the only two options here but both frustrate me so I'm trying to reconcile which one I can live with. XP

[newnumber6]

The machines have the same goals but generally they'd probably have a different perspective, coldder, more logical nad probably more informed. That is, a human might go back in time to change history for the better (for them), either not realizing that it won't actually change anything for the specific people they care about (since that timeline will still exist, exactly the same), or even if they do, they'll comfort themselves with "okay, but at least I'll be helping one universe full of people have a better situation

[newnumber6]

Re: John Henry's repetitions. I dunno, I personally took it to sort of be a sign that he's growing out of his baby phase where he was just asking questions and absorbing information, he was trying to specifically make decisions and comments and be 'active', even if it only meant, in some cases, parrotting back what somebody else said. And that he's closer to Catherine in personality than Ellison

[kissingdaylight]

Isn't it more baby-ish to just repeat things and no ask questions? I agree about the Weaver part. I like when she called John Henry her and Ellison's "boy" - like they had a child or something. Weirdness.

I think extensive history would be so cool. Do you think Weaver would really make inferior models. Yes, we know that Cameron is "special" in some way, but why make the old chip version if you can make virtually indestructible T-1000s? And why would sub-Weaver change her mind?

Eh, Weaver said that Savannah *and* Ellison's survival depended on John Henry, so I think she really just meant the human race. An adult taking part in creating their own childhood is weird to me. I obviously accept it with John, but it's still strange. (I tried to explain the basic concept to my mother, and she couldn't even wrap her head around that much.)

I am glad after reading BAG's interview that they have season 3 planned out and this wasn't just the writer's giving up. We might actually get some answers!

[newnumber6]

Repeating does seem more babyish than asking questions, for a human, but to me at least, for John Henry, it strikes me as a step from a passive, gathering information stage to an active, making decisions and declarations and evaluating the information. It's still hesitant about it which is why it seems juvenile. But that's just me