more Angel rambling and other stuff

[kattahj]

A lot of you answered my poll on French kissing - thank you! After 28 votes, ten of you have replied that French kissing is as good as or better than in the movies. Ten more have said that it's fun by overrated. Eight have said it's either gross or boring. Interestingly enough, of the ones who said "boring" (which would have been my choice), three

Comments

[lilith_morgana]

the honest-to-God, Joss Whedon-trademarked "daddy doesn't love me."

I have such a fetish for Wesley's father issues. So trite, so Joss, but so good when it works.

The guy is like a Greek Tragedy in human form.

Gods, yes. And it's so gooood. I think, too, that one of the reasons I love the man so much is because he's utterly and completely human in a fandom where a lot of the characters aren't. He can't blame anything on being soulless or part-demon or controlled by higher powers. He's just a man, with (mostly) good intentions who fucks up and fails and suffers. Add a hopeless love life, too. Now that's good tragedy.

[kattahj]

I have such a fetish for Wesley's father issues. So trite, so Joss, but so good when it works.

I think one reason it works so well is because it's not being overused. There's the throwaway lines in I Got You..., the phone call in Belonging, the thinking-out-loud in Fredless, and then Lineage, and that's pretty much it. (I've seen theories that his Billy behaviour might have been daddy-influenced as well, but that's neither been proven nor disproven.)

He can't blame anything on being soulless or part-demon or controlled by higher powers. He's just a man, with (mostly) good intentions who fucks up and fails and suffers.

Yes. That's so very true. And I think it's vital that whenever he does something questionable (like taking Connor, or sending Faith into the dreamland), we get to see why he does it. He may be wrong and petty sometimes, but s3 of Buffy aside, we get to understand that pettiness and wrongness.

And the poor guy never catches a break. It's hard to pass judgement on someone who is made miserable time after another.

[lilith_morgana]

Definitely works well, and I was thinking about it as I tried to write down thoughts on seasons 2-4. I love how they just drop hints, and leave it at that - had it been a major plot point with long confessions of how he suffered as a child, it would have been beyond horrid. Instead they let these things define and affect Wesley in a very subtle way. And in his case the father issues are relevant, too. Joss likes to throw them in all over the place, when they serve little purpose, but in this case he succeeds.

He may be wrong and petty sometimes, but s3 of Buffy aside, we get to understand that pettiness and wrongness.

Angel as a show is rather good at that. They handled Holtz fairly well, too. I had started to like him when he checked out.

And the poor guy never catches a break. It's hard to pass judgement on someone who is made miserable time after another.I know. I was browsing through Television without Pity's recaps and it was fascinating to see how much hatred for Wesley they had managed to throw in. Apparently they don't

[kattahj]

had it been a major plot point with long confessions of how he suffered as a child, it would have been beyond horrid.

Yes. I like that they leave things for the imagination.

And in his case the father issues are relevant, too. Joss likes to throw them in all over the place, when they serve little purpose, but in this case he succeeds.

It's like, parents in the Buffyverse are either horrid or dead. Or Joyce, but even she died eventually. But for Wes, it really informs his character, his longing to do right, his insecurities, his ruthlessness... Up to the point where nine shots is a logical solution to the problem.

They handled Holtz fairly well, too. I had started to like him when he checked out.

Yeah. He's a manipulative bastard, but you feel for him. Plus, that voice, mmmmmm... (I listened to some ads on darktale.tv, and it almost made me want to rush out and buy Coca-Cola.)

I was browsing through Television without Pity's recaps and it was fascinating to see how much hatred for Wesley they had managed to throw in.Well, Strega

[lilith_morgana]

Horrid, dead or invisible (Willow's parents are one big example) I should say. And Spike's mum who's somewhere in between and mostly just freaks me out. Hee.

Yeah. He's a manipulative bastard, but you feel for him.

Absolutely. And he's so good at revenge, too. You can't help but feeling impressed.

She thinks Doyle was sexually harrassing Cordelia, for crying out loud.

Hahaha. How is that even possible? Sweet little low-key who Doyle is almost as repressed as Wesley, for fuck's sake - since when are school girl crushes harrassment?

[kattahj]

Horrid, dead or invisible (Willow's parents are one big example) I should say.

Well, Willow's mum did try to burn her and then promptly forgot everything she didn't want to know. But yeah, demonic influence, not entirely her fault.

Hahaha. How is that even possible? Sweet little low-key who Doyle is almost as repressed as Wesley, for fuck's sake - since when are school girl crushes harrassment?

I got so baffled I couldn't even argue properly. It's so silly - harrassment would require that Doyle was somehow in a power position over Cordelia, and that his advances made her uncomfortable, and neither one of those factors is true. "An alternate reality in which you're Matthew McConaghey" isn't the way you blow off someone you feel is harrassing you.

As I said, insane.