Really?
Thomas: I am curious? Did you participate in slutwalk? You don't seem like a slut. :)
I was readying your facebook update
it loked like you've been having a good time with people.
me: I don't seem like a slut? How do you define a slut?
I wrote a note about Slutwalk Chicago
21:29 Maybe you should read it, first?
Thomas: I only saw that you had met up with someone after
I guess I will have to go read it.
Give me a sec.9 minutes
21:39 Thomas: Ah, now I understand
I agree. sexual assault is never anyone's fault except the assaulters
21:40 me: Da.
21:41 Thomas: it seems weird that anyone would think differently
me: It does.
21:42 Thomas: do you think people wear unnecessarily tempting clothing though?
Thanks... Nice to know I "don't seem like a slut."
me: How is it unnecessarily tempting?
21:43 Thomas: well, when one reveals the most sexual part of themselves they will autmatically set off a biological response in a man.
Obviously the man has to choose what to do about it.
but why would the woman want to pester the man with that to begin with.
21:45 me: "why would the woman want to pester the man with that to begin with"? It's perfectly possible that was never her intention .And I don't understand what you mean by "reveals the most sexual part of themselves" What is this "most sexual part of themselves"?
21:46 Thomas: well... either the breasts or the vaginal area
bikinis
that sort of stuff
21:47 me: Bikinis?
What about men's bare chests?
Thomas: I don't think that's cool either
fyi
If you want to read the rest of it here, cool. He does question this rationally. I don't know if he got heated up on his own end, and that he had better control over how he phrased words and and stuff than me.
I was upset from the first comment of his of me not seeming like a slut, and then, and then, him asking abut females wearing "unnecessarily tempting" clothes. I know, I know he agrees and states several times that it is the man's fault for assaulting the female and not hte victim's fault -- it seems we're generalizing about males assaulting females, at least until the end -- but that whole "temptation" thing just...reeks, still, implicitly of blaming the female. And it reminds me of how I was raised. How I had to watch what I wore in case I tempted men, in case I made them think thoughts.
I'd agree there are times where people can be blamed for the type of thoughts they cause others to think -- primarily emotional abuse comes to mind -- and a few times my answers were simplistic but still, just...to think that, say that, ask that...
21:48 me: As someone who's live in Malaysia and had to wear long pants and no tank tops or sleeveless tops or tight clothing, I can say being able to wear tank tops or shorts or skirts is relieving in humid weather
21:49 *lived
Thomas: I can believe that
but that as never wanted me to take my shirt off.
in humid weather
I donknow. feel too vulnerable
me: for some people their bodies aren't sexual unless they mentally feel sexual
regardless of what they wear
21:50 *unless/until
21:51 Thomas: see that may be true for them, but if you show off something commonly known as sexual you are unnecessarily sending the wrong message
21:52 me: Babies drink from breasts. Breasts are not inherently sexual part of the female body
21:54 Thomas: I suppose not in all cultures
but they are in this one
21:55 and while trying to make a statement about them not needing to be is nice... you're also distracting a lot of people who'd prefer to be thinking about other things in the process.
21:56 me: Then those people can look somewhere else and stop being distracted.
Thomas: but hy do you feel the need to distract them knowing that you will do so?
21:57 me: Maybe those people don't feel they will they will distract others
Thomas: they they are kidding themselves
don'you think?
me: No.
Thomas: I mean sort of common sense?
21:58 me: What kind of level of revealing-ness are you talking about?
Thomas: I meant more like bikinis, extremely low cut tank tops, that sort of stuff
me: If bikinis are a no-go does that also include one piece bathing suits because that can shown cleavage, too, and not fully cover people's bottoms.
Thomas: really short shorts
me: ?
21:59 Thomas: I think uld put one pieces there too, except maybe the ones with skirts, shorts
22:01 me: I'm guessing you don't visit the pool or bikini often, then?
I don't think if someone can be "unnecessarily tempting." Nobody is inviting someone to touch them or have sex with them unless they say so
22:02 Thomas: of course
but they are inviting those thoughts by displaying themselves in sexual way
22:03 me: And...?
Thomas: so, why would you want to invite those thoughts?
22:04 me: Why should it matter?
Thomas: it just seems odd that you would want to invite those thoughts
22:05 me: Those thoughts being...?
Be explicit.
22:06 Thomas: sexual in nature?
arousing?
I don't know
that category
22:10 me: I don't think this is something you can understand, just as there things I can't understand. Things, meaning perspectives or opinions or events
Thomas: I supose that's true
one off the stinky things about the human condition
sometimes you just can't quite get in the other person's heart
22:12 me: Yes.
22:13 And I think your question was insulting in that it still, implicitly, blamed the woman.
Thomas: no, I don't blame the woman
but I don't think either man or woman should be tempting others to evil thoughts
We all know that people have different weaknesses, and this is a common weakness for men, lust that is.
22:14 I wouldn't want to do anything that would cahllenge you in an area that you're weak
me: I think it's weak to generalize and blame biology for societal blaming.
Thomas: it's not societal blaming
I don't blame the woman at all.
It's totally the man's fault
22:15 but I also believe you shouldn't purposely push at men's weaknesses and I know a lot of women who dress provocatively to do just that.
22:17 me: And men wolf whistle and rape and assault women who aren't dressed provocatively in any way.
I had a man tell me "nice tits" when I was walking to Walgreens within the first or second week of moving here
and I wasn't wearing a tight tshirt or a tank top
22:18 or anything with cleavage
Thomas: yep, I know.
I hate those guys too.
22:19 me: Again, though, I think it's ridiculous to use biology to excuse for "men's weaknesses." Women are/can be as sexual as men.
Thomas: and yet there are very few women rapists.
why is th
22:20 me: ...
I can't believe you just asked that.
I am very upset right now.
22:21 Thomas: well, its true isn't it
you say don't blame biology...
me: I have been since your first comment asking me about slutwalk and saying I didn't look like a slut.
Thomas: and yet statistically some biological process must have something to do tiwth it
me: snorts
Thomas: or sociologically men are trained to be that way?
22:22 me: Patriarchally, to think of women's bodies as property?
That women aren't humans to have their own decisions abou their own bodies?
Thomas: no
22:23 me: In a lot of societies, females are just bodies
I'm upset.
Thomas: I know
t's onef the saddest things I know
me: I do'nt wish to chat about this anymore, nor chat with you right now.
Have a good evening, Thomas.
22:24 Thomas: you too
And yeah, probably there are statistically more male rapists/sxual assauterls than female ones, but I got confused near the end if we were talking adult-adult or also cindluing children. I know i didn't end hte chat on arational note but...gah. I know it's likely others will read the chat and think I'm really overreacting and that he brings up good points or that he didn't raise his opniionions like an asshole douche and my feelings are blinding me to that. To be fair, he is a little on the conservative side, which is no surpsrised this reminded me of my aprents and how I was raised.
But I sitll feel even if a man's thoughts suddenly veer towards sexually thinking about a woman and that was her intent (because a lot of the times a woman wearing a sundress with a little cleavage doesn't want men to think of her that way or it doesn't even enter her mind but she just want st o dress lightly in the weather), why should that matter?